Theft
Returning to the main problem, here's another plea for a "softly softly" approach at least to begin with: it is possible (stupid perhaps but possible) to pack stuff by mistake, as I and others know ! as discussed in a similar thread years ago:
viewtopic.php?t=5858&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
I wouldn't have appreciated an immediately accusatory tone. Hope you get them back!
viewtopic.php?t=5858&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
I wouldn't have appreciated an immediately accusatory tone. Hope you get them back!
Yes if you use Paypal, this is efficient - but you then need to ensure that all your guests pay the security deposit by Paypal even if they pay their rental by other means.7 Aspire wrote: Can't comment on the apparent slowness of your processing speed, but would suggest that PP is the best cost/time solution for taking/returning security deposits.
These days I rarely take rental payment by PP, but for guests that pay rent by credit card, I always take their security deposit by PP.
Logging in (with bookmarks and auto-fill) takes less than 10 secs; generating a payment request takes less than 30 secs, and initiating a refund thereafter, is just a case of hitting the refund button associated with the transaction and confirming the amount, ~10 secs.
As to cost, with a full deposit refund, the reimbursement of all the PP fees except the fixed per transaction fee, limits the financial cost to 20p per refund.
I don't think guests will like this - they want to pay their security deposit the same way and at the same time that they pay their rental. And you then have to send 2 separate invoices - one for the rental with payment details for that and one for the security deposit.
You could insist that your guests pay their rental by Paypal and no other means but then you have expensive Paypal transaction charges to pay on all your bookings. (So the cost then is more than 20p per booking)
I think 7Aspire that almost all your bookings come from commission sites and they handle the rental payments for you so it is not so much of a problem?
Thank you all for your help, advice and illuminating comments.
I sent the softer email and I have received a very apologetic reply and a promise to post the towels back to me - yay!
Sadly no bath mat.... but 2 out of 3 is great.
Irritating and yes I had to nip out and purchase 2 new sets of towels as mismatched linen is not an option.
With regard to security deposits, I don't think I am going there.
It is another layer of administration that I can live without and having not taken deposits for so long and coming through relatively unscathed I conclude that they may not be necessary.
I do have a policy of asking guests to let me know if something is broken so that I have a fighting chance of getting things replaced or repaired before the next guests arrive and this appears to be working well.
Once again - thank you all!
I sent the softer email and I have received a very apologetic reply and a promise to post the towels back to me - yay!
Sadly no bath mat.... but 2 out of 3 is great.
Irritating and yes I had to nip out and purchase 2 new sets of towels as mismatched linen is not an option.
With regard to security deposits, I don't think I am going there.
It is another layer of administration that I can live without and having not taken deposits for so long and coming through relatively unscathed I conclude that they may not be necessary.
I do have a policy of asking guests to let me know if something is broken so that I have a fighting chance of getting things replaced or repaired before the next guests arrive and this appears to be working well.
Once again - thank you all!
Today's going to be a great day!
x-
AngloDutch
- Posts: 727
- Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2014 10:25 pm
- Location: Netherlands
If you get away without losing anything (purposely taken or not), then you are very lucky indeed.
The worst offenders we find are those that arrive in their own cars, because obviously they have the ability to remove it all.
Over the last 11 years we have learned a great deal from our mistakes in dealing with guests.
One of our biggest mistakes was to hand back security deposits before guests left, this due mostly to the cost of depositing cash into a bank account here in the NL. These were mostly guests booking via an agency where the extra costs (tourist tax, energy, cleaning, linen charge and the security charge) were collected in cash. Now we ask for the extra costs to be transferred by agency guests before arrival and then we transfer the deposit back within a week after departure.
What was happening was that agency groups were asking us when/how the deposit would be returned and we would say that we would check the accommodation just before they were ready to leave and return it then (as many owners do). Some, armed with this knowledge, would then take small items which we wouldn't have time to check - cds from inside the case for example, or some of the books/dvds/toys.
We have very few valuable things inside our holiday home (the LCD TVs are probably the most expensive items, unless they steal the furniture!) It is just the irritation I suppose, plus the cost of replacing items in the kitchen which all adds up over a year.
Funnily enough, more things are left behind than get stolen.
Over the years we've had enough clothes left behind to outfit half the village, plus toys often go missing (maybe the parents weren't sure what was theirs, and what was ours?) and in their place many other toys are left behind.
We had one family from Toronto many years ago whose daughter was crying herself to sleep because she had left a cuddly toy behind. It appeared that they had forgotten more than that and I remember we ended up shipping a whole box of toys and clothes back to them.
Since 2005, we've found a laptop, a Nintendo console, an expensive watch, much jewellery, a lot of pairs of glasses, a 2 meter board game, a pot of money, many coats, charging cords from every make of phone, tablet and PC imaginable, a photo album with the last photos taken of someone’s deceased relative, plus enough pots, pans, cutlery, glassware and plates to equip a second holiday home.
We don’t charge security deposit for guests coming from outside the NL, as from experience, we have very few problems with these groups.
We do tend to trust people maybe too much but have certainly protected ourselves now from the largest offenders - those guests coming via local agencies who you have mostly no contact with prior to arrival date (even after emailing them additional information, once we receive their contact details a few weeks before arrival).
I think there is a big difference when you have contact with your guests beforehand and the guests who turn up via the agencies, where you receive limited information on them and any particular requests that they may have.
The worst offenders we find are those that arrive in their own cars, because obviously they have the ability to remove it all.
Over the last 11 years we have learned a great deal from our mistakes in dealing with guests.
One of our biggest mistakes was to hand back security deposits before guests left, this due mostly to the cost of depositing cash into a bank account here in the NL. These were mostly guests booking via an agency where the extra costs (tourist tax, energy, cleaning, linen charge and the security charge) were collected in cash. Now we ask for the extra costs to be transferred by agency guests before arrival and then we transfer the deposit back within a week after departure.
What was happening was that agency groups were asking us when/how the deposit would be returned and we would say that we would check the accommodation just before they were ready to leave and return it then (as many owners do). Some, armed with this knowledge, would then take small items which we wouldn't have time to check - cds from inside the case for example, or some of the books/dvds/toys.
We have very few valuable things inside our holiday home (the LCD TVs are probably the most expensive items, unless they steal the furniture!) It is just the irritation I suppose, plus the cost of replacing items in the kitchen which all adds up over a year.
Funnily enough, more things are left behind than get stolen.
Over the years we've had enough clothes left behind to outfit half the village, plus toys often go missing (maybe the parents weren't sure what was theirs, and what was ours?) and in their place many other toys are left behind.
We had one family from Toronto many years ago whose daughter was crying herself to sleep because she had left a cuddly toy behind. It appeared that they had forgotten more than that and I remember we ended up shipping a whole box of toys and clothes back to them.
Since 2005, we've found a laptop, a Nintendo console, an expensive watch, much jewellery, a lot of pairs of glasses, a 2 meter board game, a pot of money, many coats, charging cords from every make of phone, tablet and PC imaginable, a photo album with the last photos taken of someone’s deceased relative, plus enough pots, pans, cutlery, glassware and plates to equip a second holiday home.
We don’t charge security deposit for guests coming from outside the NL, as from experience, we have very few problems with these groups.
We do tend to trust people maybe too much but have certainly protected ourselves now from the largest offenders - those guests coming via local agencies who you have mostly no contact with prior to arrival date (even after emailing them additional information, once we receive their contact details a few weeks before arrival).
I think there is a big difference when you have contact with your guests beforehand and the guests who turn up via the agencies, where you receive limited information on them and any particular requests that they may have.
Last edited by AngloDutch on Thu Jun 04, 2015 8:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
It should not be neglected the possible cost of damage caused by guests who feel more at ease to damage things just because they did not pay any security deposit.newtimber wrote:The cost of taking and returning a security deposit is not zero - unless you count your time for free and you don't accept credit cards and your bank doesn't charge anything.arkvilla wrote:Moral of the story..... always take a security deposit
If this is the first time in 5 years that this has happened, then the cost of taking the security deposit for all those bookings (say 150 security deposits taken and returned) is going to be more than a set of towels...
I had a nice pen disappear 2 weeks ago. I specifically bought it & left it on the visitors book.
Guest arrived, left & Pen was gone.
As above, emailed gently asking if said pens whereabouts were known. I just got a terse reply saying no way did they take it, what on earth was I doing even considering they had. All I asked was had they seen it as it was not where I left it.
I've checked the whole villa myself, it was there before. So not only are they thieves but also have a problem with telling the truth. TBH the confrontational email back was the giveaway.
I refunded the deposit in full as I don't want anything to do with people like that - I'd prefer to be empty. Place was a bit of a tip too when they left, funny thing is they said in the email they treated everything with respect & they lived in a beautiful home.
As usual, next guests arriving are polite & respectful so job satisfaction regained. Such a shame the odd idiot spoils it for the rest.
Guest arrived, left & Pen was gone.
As above, emailed gently asking if said pens whereabouts were known. I just got a terse reply saying no way did they take it, what on earth was I doing even considering they had. All I asked was had they seen it as it was not where I left it.
I've checked the whole villa myself, it was there before. So not only are they thieves but also have a problem with telling the truth. TBH the confrontational email back was the giveaway.
I refunded the deposit in full as I don't want anything to do with people like that - I'd prefer to be empty. Place was a bit of a tip too when they left, funny thing is they said in the email they treated everything with respect & they lived in a beautiful home.
As usual, next guests arriving are polite & respectful so job satisfaction regained. Such a shame the odd idiot spoils it for the rest.
But the point was that this was the first time in 5 years it happened - so it doesn't show that guests are more at ease to damage things if there is no security deposit in this situation as there was no security deposit taken for 5 years...pjmatos wrote:It should not be neglected the possible cost of damage caused by guests who feel more at ease to damage things just because they did not pay any security deposit.newtimber wrote:The cost of taking and returning a security deposit is not zero - unless you count your time for free and you don't accept credit cards and your bank doesn't charge anything.arkvilla wrote:Moral of the story..... always take a security deposit
If this is the first time in 5 years that this has happened, then the cost of taking the security deposit for all those bookings (say 150 security deposits taken and returned) is going to be more than a set of towels...
Don't get me wrong - it's not the first problem I have had in 5 years, but it is the first time stuff has been taken.
I've had wet towels left on pine waxed chairs.... fixed by a lovely local lady for free!! Wet towels draped on a waxed pine wardrobe etc etc.
To be honest, I do think I've had a fairly good ride and I find life easier without taking a security deposit. I may well change that view if in the future extensive damage is done, but I try to think about it all as wear and tear and just hope that I can fix the problem before my next guests arrive.
I've had wet towels left on pine waxed chairs.... fixed by a lovely local lady for free!! Wet towels draped on a waxed pine wardrobe etc etc.
To be honest, I do think I've had a fairly good ride and I find life easier without taking a security deposit. I may well change that view if in the future extensive damage is done, but I try to think about it all as wear and tear and just hope that I can fix the problem before my next guests arrive.
Today's going to be a great day!
I'll dump that off my "Bright Ideas" list then.....newtimber wrote:We used to lose pens every week - so got 75 nice promotional pens with our website address printed on them. Good advertising I thought - but now no pens are taken at all...gardenboy wrote:I had a nice pen disappear 2 weeks ago. I specifically bought it & left it on the visitors book.
I wasn't talking only about J00ls's experience, despite as you can see there can happen different kind of problems when people don't charge a security deposit.newtimber wrote:But the point was that this was the first time in 5 years it happened - so it doesn't show that guests are more at ease to damage things if there is no security deposit in this situation as there was no security deposit taken for 5 years...pjmatos wrote:It should not be neglected the possible cost of damage caused by guests who feel more at ease to damage things just because they did not pay any security deposit.newtimber wrote: The cost of taking and returning a security deposit is not zero - unless you count your time for free and you don't accept credit cards and your bank doesn't charge anything.
If this is the first time in 5 years that this has happened, then the cost of taking the security deposit for all those bookings (say 150 security deposits taken and returned) is going to be more than a set of towels...
The whole point is that you cannot neglect all the possible costs if you want to do your calcs correctly.