Andalucia approves regulations of holiday apartments

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CSE
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Post by CSE »

YOU WILL BE ABLE TO DO BED AND BREAKFAST LEGALLY!!
But that of course could mean other sort of (more) inspections.
Serving food means you have to have Manipulador de Alimentos certificate.
We have to keep cleaning the kitchen, The temperatures the food is stored in the fridge. No serving your own home grown food as bills (not the shop receipt) of where and when you have purchased the food.
All of this has to be written in a book and be ready when the health inspector calls. And We can confirm he does.
Running a B&B will also mean you have to register your guests at the website for the Guardia Civil.
Amongst a whole list of other regulations we have to comply with.
So if you do want to run a legal B&B think twice about the consequence of having to comply with regulations/laws after the first hurdle of registration in Andalusia.
Never try to out-stubborn your guests.
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Post by costa-brava »

I believe you have a Casa Rural CASANTO, which has its own regulations.
All the rules have not yet been published but I think it will just be breakfast that's allowed and will not be an obligatory part of the deal. It really looks like the authorities are accepting the inevitability of Airbnb type bookings and just want to pull everybody into some form of legality.
It will be interesting to see how it pans out.
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CSE
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Post by CSE »

That is what you believe. But experience shows us the picture. We have no free ride. You post makes it sound oh so easy. But you have seriously failed to inform our good reader about other facts like how to pay IVA, how to register a business to pay taxes. Plus a lot of other things.

One other point that needs to discussed about the facts missing from this "easy money post". If it was that simple do you really think that the hotel trade would allow this. It is after all them that seem to behind the push for regulations here in Spain.
Never try to out-stubborn your guests.
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CSE
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Post by CSE »

Sadly someone has died because of a possible previous health issues, which is suggested was further complicated due to salmonella poisoning. In addition 64 other people have also been poisoned at the same bar.

http://www.diariodecadiz.es/article/cad ... maldi.html

The idea the new system of small B&Bs that serve food/breakfast will exempt from a health/food regime of checks and traceability of food, may be in for a shock. There are already request to "step up" the relevant inspections.
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Post by costa-brava »

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Post by Casscat »

There is a lot of knicker-wetting going on out there in Andalusian urban-holiday-lettings-land but largely that is amongst the folk who have blithely rented their Costa apartments and villas without ever straying into the world of income declaration whether in Spain or the UK. It's not the regulation in terms of accommodation standards that is spooking them so much as the fact that the gravy train might hit the buffers. What has escaped the attention of many is that unlike other parts of Spain (largely the islands as I understand it) they are at least being allowed to continue to market their places for rental! In fact most properties will already meet the required standards and the cost of registering will be minimal or even free of charge (I paid nothing to get sign off as a vivienda rural). This leaves 'fear of disclosing income and paying tax' as the cause of panic in the ranks.
Last edited by Casscat on Wed Feb 10, 2016 7:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Sanchisimo »

You've hit the nail on the head there. The regulations are sensible and clear, and, if the system is as easy to register as it has been for a Vivienda Turistica or Casa Rural, easy to implement. It will be good for Andalucía's reputation too if people feel they are getting a basic set of standards when they book.

As you say, there are some that are terrified that this will bring the spotlight of the tax people on them and that forms will have to be filled out has got them into a tizzy on some of the expat forums. You could easily substitute driving licence, padrón, building licence, vehicle registration or any other such simple proceedures in it's place and get the same reaction.
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Post by CSE »

Casscat this is very true. Yes it does have other implications further down the line. But is it worth getting very worried over I doubt it.

If the property owners keep to renting out whole lets then it sounds keep to what Sanchisimo rightly says things are just like obtaining other documentation. Maybe it is the language barrier that some are not so sure about.

It is unfair to suggest that there will be exemptions from existing EU/Spanish/ Anderlusian regulations.

There will always be illegals. There are here in Galicia, sadly to say most are run by expats.
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Post by CSE »

Having now had time to read the PDF document there dose not seem to anything about allowing property owners to serve breakfast.
http://www.juntadeandalucia.es/export/d ... sticos.pdf
Here is the section which describes the property requirements
Artículo 5. Tipos.
1. Las viviendas con fines turísticos podrán ser:
a) Completas, cuando la vivienda se cede en su totalidad.
b) Por habitaciones, debiendo la persona propietaria residir en ella. En estos casos, podrán utilizar las denominaciones internacionalmente reconocidas para este tipo de alojamiento.
2. La capacidad máxima de éstas, vendrá limitada a lo dispuesto en la licencia de ocupación. En todo caso, cuando el uso de la vivienda sea completo no podrá ser superior a quince plazas y cuando el uso sea por habitaciones, no podrá superar las seis plazas, no pudiendo exceder en ambos tipos de cuatro plazas por habitación.
Have we missed something?
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Post by cleanforum »

"(I paid nothing to get sign off as a vivienda rural)"

Casscat I would love to know how to proceed with the formalities of registering our vivienda rural...can you tell me how you did it? :?:
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Post by Casscat »

cleanforum wrote:"(I paid nothing to get sign off as a vivienda rural)"

Casscat I would love to know how to proceed with the formalities of registering our vivienda rural...can you tell me how you did it? :?:
I got someone to do it for me cleanforum! :lol: In my case a friend of a friend to whom I paid €50 for her trouble (she had to go into Malaga to sort it). An inspector came, looked around, professed himself happy and left me with a sheet of paper showing the logo I had to then pay to have made into a specifically measured tile to affix to my property proudly displaying to all the world that I was indeed an official Vivienda Rural. My licence number then came in the post. I would assume that a gestor could do this for you quite easily.
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Post by Casscat »

The sort of clarity I have come to expect from Spain-Holiday:
https://www.spain-holiday.com/rentalbuz ... -andalucia

Purveyors of air con may be in for a bit of a bonanza! :P
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cleanforum
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Post by cleanforum »

Wow that was a stroke of luck having a gestor friend. My Spanish wife is my gestor so I guess we´ll be heading off to Malaga soon.. Do you happen to know which office she went to ? the
diputation maybe?
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Post by pepsipuss »

Very sincere thanks to all who have posted to try to clarify.

I have read through the whole lot in Spanish and find it mostly reasonably clear but Article 6 d which requires 'refrigeracion por elementos fijos' in bedrooms and living rooms is a bit bothersome. Does this really mean air conditioning or are ceiling fans adequate? Surely they don't expect people to make an investment of mega thousands to put in aircon in houses where no guest has ever complained of inadequate cooling?

We have been legal technically in terms of paying tax for years but if we were to have to install a/c it would cost us more than a whole year's turnover and the incremental rental obtained would be negligible.
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Post by pepsipuss »

I have now followed the links in Spain Holiday and find that rural properties are exempt and have their own rules (hopefully not including aircon which would put us out of business),

However the link provided by SH for rural properties rules takes you to pages and pages of guff when all we really want to know is how is a property defined as rural and if it is, what are the rules

Any ideas anyone?
For true domestic harmony it is essential that dogs know their place, which is below all cats

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