Aw!! That's almost as tragic a piece of news as Fraise losing that lovely bottle of St Emilion!alexia s. wrote: (In these times of social unease I am maintaining a neutral approach to the festive season. Jane might like to know that Cronulla and Brighton beaches in her old feeding-ground - it was Sydney, wasn't it? - have been closed to goats of all persuasions. This, in the middle of summer.)
The Future of Rental Listing Sites
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Giddy Goat
- Posts: 9054
- Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2005 7:38 am
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Nostalgia isn't what it used to be
Paolo,paolo wrote:Alexia,
It sounds like you have shifted dangerously close to my view of listing sites - you pay them for and judge them by enquiries, not bookings.
The above would indicate that you might consider a "pay per enquiry" model. However, I seem to recall from a previous post that you were very sceptical of that model, presumably on the grounds that not all enquiries are equal ?
There are sites out there ( e.g. Directvacationrentals.com, no affiliation) that offer a "pay per enquiry" model, but so far they have not caught on. I suspect most owners don't like the "variable" cost associated with paying for enquiries, without the gaurantee that at least some will turn into bookings.
Kevin
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Alan Knighting
- Posts: 4120
- Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 7:26 am
- Location: Monflanquin, Lot-et-Garonne, France
Kevin,
“Pay per enquiry� - you must be joking. It is so obviously open to abuse by the site owners themselves that it’s not worth thinking about.
Thank you but, no thank you. I’ll stay with an annual fee for a Rental Site to generate enquiries. I’ll stay with my job of turning the enquiries into bookings.
As an alternative, I’ll sell 20 weeks to a Rental Company and let them worry about the bookings.
What I will not do is pay a Rental Company for each “spurious� enquiry that goes - nowhere.
I will pay for a service but I’m not in this game to bolster other peoples’ profits.
Alan
“Pay per enquiry� - you must be joking. It is so obviously open to abuse by the site owners themselves that it’s not worth thinking about.
Thank you but, no thank you. I’ll stay with an annual fee for a Rental Site to generate enquiries. I’ll stay with my job of turning the enquiries into bookings.
As an alternative, I’ll sell 20 weeks to a Rental Company and let them worry about the bookings.
What I will not do is pay a Rental Company for each “spurious� enquiry that goes - nowhere.
I will pay for a service but I’m not in this game to bolster other peoples’ profits.
Alan
I think rental websites will develop to be much more focused players. The opportunity to be another holiday-rentals or holidaylettings has been competed away.
Niche websites will need to tailor their offer to the economics of their advertisers. The reason why several payment models will be required is illustrated below.
Advertiser 1 has a lovely villa in the south of rfance which lets at £3K to £4K per week in peak season. For this advertiser 3 or 4 sites charging a fixed £150 to £180 pa is very viable - just 2 peak weeks from each works out at about 2.5% advertising cost..
Advertiser 2 has a lovely 2 bedroom apartment which lets at less than £400 per week in peak season. For the high priced fixed charge websites 2 peak week bookings works out at 23% advertising cost! Just to get to a 10% advertising cost the site would have to deliver nearly 5 peak weeks! (And many people on this site have declared 10% to be "way too much".)
Whereas Advertiser 1 would be bonkers to (primarilarly) sign up with an agency wanting 10% of rents, for advertiser 2 it may make sense as an additional sales channel.
Finding myself in the advertiser 2 category (and there are many people in this category), I would love to find sites which charge 5% of bookings achieved or £20 per booking or variations on that theme. Difficult for the site owner to monitor but eh guys, pull yer finger out and go for some potentially profitable niches you're missing right now.
I am sure these models will appear. If they don't sites such as H-R are close to pricing themselves out of a fairly substantial market. As I have posted elsewhere, I have signed up for a money back guaranteed ad with H-R - if they don't deliver 4 plus weeks of peak booking I'm trousering my money and off to look elsewhere, to get below the 10% cost of bookings!
Like Alan, I would not pay for enquiries, clicks, page views, referrals or other interesting but non revenue generating statistics.
Cheers
Tudor
www.frigiliana-apartment.com
Niche websites will need to tailor their offer to the economics of their advertisers. The reason why several payment models will be required is illustrated below.
Advertiser 1 has a lovely villa in the south of rfance which lets at £3K to £4K per week in peak season. For this advertiser 3 or 4 sites charging a fixed £150 to £180 pa is very viable - just 2 peak weeks from each works out at about 2.5% advertising cost..
Advertiser 2 has a lovely 2 bedroom apartment which lets at less than £400 per week in peak season. For the high priced fixed charge websites 2 peak week bookings works out at 23% advertising cost! Just to get to a 10% advertising cost the site would have to deliver nearly 5 peak weeks! (And many people on this site have declared 10% to be "way too much".)
Whereas Advertiser 1 would be bonkers to (primarilarly) sign up with an agency wanting 10% of rents, for advertiser 2 it may make sense as an additional sales channel.
Finding myself in the advertiser 2 category (and there are many people in this category), I would love to find sites which charge 5% of bookings achieved or £20 per booking or variations on that theme. Difficult for the site owner to monitor but eh guys, pull yer finger out and go for some potentially profitable niches you're missing right now.
I am sure these models will appear. If they don't sites such as H-R are close to pricing themselves out of a fairly substantial market. As I have posted elsewhere, I have signed up for a money back guaranteed ad with H-R - if they don't deliver 4 plus weeks of peak booking I'm trousering my money and off to look elsewhere, to get below the 10% cost of bookings!
Like Alan, I would not pay for enquiries, clicks, page views, referrals or other interesting but non revenue generating statistics.
Cheers
Tudor
www.frigiliana-apartment.com
Sometimes i sits and thinks - and sometimes i just sits...
" If they don't sites such as H-R are close to pricing themselves out of a fairly substantial market. "
HR is encouraging the low end of the market (see my other post on their latest newsletter). Either this is a monumental mistake or they are going to change their charging scheme. Either way I see a mistake: if they change their charging scheme so as to penalise top of the market properties they will lose the advertisers that make any rental site good to look at.
HR is encouraging the low end of the market (see my other post on their latest newsletter). Either this is a monumental mistake or they are going to change their charging scheme. Either way I see a mistake: if they change their charging scheme so as to penalise top of the market properties they will lose the advertisers that make any rental site good to look at.
Best,
Alexia.
Alexia.
No. H-R is not aiming at the "low end". It launched a campaign at one of its segments.
Next week it may target the golf segment, the ski segment, the beach segment, the young family with gurgling babies segment. And other segments I consider unattractive. Non of these segments are "wrong" - unless you have a property not aimed at them.
My point was that H-R are trying to be all things to all holidaymakers/owners but have a pricing structure inclined toward the "top end", as evidenced by your post which revealed (I think) very few properties in the £10 bracket.
I think that sites which think they can be all things to all men will succeed less than those which focus, and that ultimately flat rate charging will be less successful (for certain properties) than payment by results.
Hence one way forward (which was the topic of this thread) will be like the conventional holiday industry, ie (in the case of H-R):
H-R sun-and-fun-properties.com
H-R luxury-retreats.com
H-R rural-France.com
H-R city-breaks.com
H-R budget-specials.com
With advertising prices set accordingly. Then you won't be upset when they target a market other than your own, and i'll be delighted because they have a pricing package appropriate for my target market and my revenue base.
Cheers
Tudor
www.frigiliana-apartment.com
Next week it may target the golf segment, the ski segment, the beach segment, the young family with gurgling babies segment. And other segments I consider unattractive. Non of these segments are "wrong" - unless you have a property not aimed at them.
My point was that H-R are trying to be all things to all holidaymakers/owners but have a pricing structure inclined toward the "top end", as evidenced by your post which revealed (I think) very few properties in the £10 bracket.
I think that sites which think they can be all things to all men will succeed less than those which focus, and that ultimately flat rate charging will be less successful (for certain properties) than payment by results.
Hence one way forward (which was the topic of this thread) will be like the conventional holiday industry, ie (in the case of H-R):
H-R sun-and-fun-properties.com
H-R luxury-retreats.com
H-R rural-France.com
H-R city-breaks.com
H-R budget-specials.com
With advertising prices set accordingly. Then you won't be upset when they target a market other than your own, and i'll be delighted because they have a pricing package appropriate for my target market and my revenue base.
Cheers
Tudor
www.frigiliana-apartment.com
Sometimes i sits and thinks - and sometimes i just sits...
Alexia - I know what you are saying because when I read h-r.com's latest newsletter it struck me that they were going budget..... but at the end of the day I have to look at it realistically they have filled my properties - (just 2 weeks from one other site) and I am on 6 other site including 4 in USA.... so h-r.com can't be getting it that wrong?
it's all a learning curve!