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Heated pools

 
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Mouse



Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Posts: 7104
Location: Balearics

PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 9:20 am    Post subject: Heated pools Reply with quote

As the season for ibiza gets ever shorter I'm seriously thinking of investing in a heated pool for the shoulder months.
Our pool is 9m by 4m with romantic steps (adds a bit of width). It is a standard depth of about 6 foot at the deep end.

Questions;
what sort of costs are involved?
What systems are recommended?
Ease of installation?
And the biggest. ....does it increase bookings (and can you charge a little more to cover costs)

I heard years ago that all heated pools here had to be done via solar panels so I will have to check up on the law.

Thanks for you help!

Mousie
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Corfudeb



Joined: 17 Jul 2011
Posts: 32
Location: Corfu, Greece

PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We had this dilemma two years ago when we wanted to make the pool temperature more comfortable in April/May and September/October. Having looked into the solar panel options we realised that the temperature would not rise enough to make a difference on the cloudy days when we really needed most additional heat. We opted for a heat pump which works like an air-conditioning unit. It was fitted easily on the outside wall of the pool house and has easy controls. It only operates when the pool pump is on so can operate on a timer or manual to boost the temp.
It cost just under 3,000 plus fitting and we bought in the UK and had it shipped by the company to Corfu, Greece.
We opted for a Duratech Dura +19 as our pool is 50 sq metres.
It has been running for one season( just the cooler weeks) and we have been delighted that the temperature now reaches a lovely 28 degrees. ( Very happy guests as we are on a mountain side!) We have yet to work out running costs but at first glance it is not excessive.
As we only get to use our villa off season it means that we can also enjoy the pool. We have increased our weekly cost for the low season weeks to cover the extra outlay.

Here is a link to the one we bought:

http://www.heatpumps4pools.com/Duratech-Dura/Duratech-Dura-Plus-19.5kw-Swimming-Pool-Heat-Pump-Heater

Hope this helps!

Debbie
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Last edited by Corfudeb on Sat Feb 20, 2016 9:55 am; edited 1 time in total
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PW in Polemi



Joined: 21 Oct 2012
Posts: 1740
Location: A village in Paphos, Cyprus

PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 9:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mousie, we use solar to heat our own pool - but it's very much a Heath Robinson type of affair, very home-made (and not in the best meaning of that description! Embarassed )

We have an infinity pool at home with the overflow on one long side rather than at the deep end as is usual. (The developer decided the pool would better fit the slightly sloping land that way, and it saved him having to build an expensive retaining wall Rolling Eyes )

So, in the deep end, we have a 12v submersible brushless pump that is connected to a small solar panel. The pump draws water out of the (very) deep end, over the edge of the pool and down into a bit of plumbing (I think it's called a manifold) that takes the pipe down a size or two into a section of black irrigation tubing. This tubing has lots of the narrow black irrigation tubing stuck into it and each narrow tube is laid across black weed suppressing matting and into another length of black irrigation tubing, which is then attached to a hose that leads back into the pool, at the shallow end.

So the cooler pool water from the deep end is pumped through many sections of tubing, (each several metres long) collecting warmth from the sun as it goes - ever turned on the hose after it's been in the sun for a while and got warm water? This increases the water temp by approx 3C per day and extends both ends of our swimming season at home.

It cost very little to make, however, it is not a thing of beauty! Embarassed Laughing If you ask Mr Google, I'm sure you will find out a lot about different types of pool heating - and I'm pretty certain some of the French-based LMHers have pool heating but I suspect not solar.

I've seen some pool heating here where the solar piping is on the roof, and there are some systems that use the pool pump - but ours is stand-alone so we can close it down during August to prevent the water going much over 30C (33C is not refreshing to swim in, and all that extra warmth encourages nasty bacteria and algae if you're not very careful).

Have you got a cover on your pool? That helps keep the warmth in - but of course, you have to ensure your tourists know how to use it properly.

I'm not sure you could actually charge extra if you installed some sort of solar pool heating, but if you collected an extra booking or 3 by detailing pool heating on your listing sites, that would surely help cover installation costs?
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Zingara



Joined: 09 Apr 2013
Posts: 584
Location: Antibes, PACA

PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm sure Teapot will be along shortly with good advice, but I agree with Corfudeb on this one: solar is great for the sunny days, but an ASHP was our preferred way. We are planning to fit one in the UK, as our Calor boiler is on it's last legs.

Yes, I believe it does increase bookings (I certainly look for a heated pool a shoulder season holiday), and there are 'ways' of charging for it (which I, for one, don't mind paying)...a lovely pool is not simply for looking at....
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Bassman



Joined: 05 Oct 2010
Posts: 720
Location: Charente Maritime

PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you are looking for a heat pump zodiac make one you dont have to plump-in it has a separate pump that sits on the side of the pool and looks very easy to set up. Prices from 1058 heat pump plus 400 for the pump on this French site
http://www.piscine-center.net/chauffage-piscine/pompe-a-chaleur/pompe-a-chaleur-piscine-psa-zodiac/pompe-a-chaleur-pac-alpha-zodiac/index.html
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Mouse



Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Posts: 7104
Location: Balearics

PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All good info - thanks! Yes I think you're right Debs on the solar. PW I know the sort of black tubing you mean....I did google solar pool heating and sAw that type. I think for us solar would be out for the reason debs and zinger mentioned; cloudy days. We have solar already for our hot water so know the conditions needed.
Also, sadly, our roof terrace is used for guests and we don't have enough flat space ink the garden either. We have a relatively small plot.

Thanks also for the indication of price...and also that you can buy and get it fitted by someone else.

Yes I'm not too fussed about hiking up the price on rentals, though if I could justify a small amount that would be a win-win. But it is more about being able to secure more bookings.

Mouse
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Zingara



Joined: 09 Apr 2013
Posts: 584
Location: Antibes, PACA

PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd certainly book in the shoulder season, if you'd heat the pool... Wink

I have 'heatable pool' in my headline, with pool heating in the text, and have had clients say that's what prompted them to book.
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Old Bill



Joined: 14 Nov 2014
Posts: 54
Location: Cessenon-sur-Orb, France

PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We installed pool heating 2 years ago. It is an electrically powered system with a heat exchanger. We were advised that solar heating would not be practical. Combined with a cover the pool, which is 12m by 5m, is certainly much warmer, up to about 28 degrees C and we have been able to swim in May and October when we are there ourselves. We charge the guests an additional fee if they want to use it. There have been no complaints about this.

This week we are on holiday ourselves in La Gomera, one of the Canary Islands, where the weather has been overcast and somewhat wet.The villa has a small solar heated pool, which is much too cold to swim in comfortably. In similar weather our French one would be very pleasant.
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teapot



Joined: 23 Oct 2013
Posts: 762
Location: Loire valley

PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not really much I can add to the topic apart from the importance of a good cover to keep the heat in.

Anyone contemplating a pool or refurbishing a pool would do well to insulate the sides and the floor to reduce the size of the heater required and the overall running costs.

Heatpumps4pools is my friend David's company and naturally I get a bit of discount which I can pass on to LMH's if interested.

Mousie, like to know if the rules say you must use solar?

Old bill, does your electric powered system resemble any of the units in the links from other members or have you got the traditional electric heater (Elecro) type? swapping that for an air source heat pump would save a fair bit of money as ASHP would only use 1/4 of the electricity.
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Mouse



Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Posts: 7104
Location: Balearics

PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Mousie, like to know if the rules say you must use solar?


Still trying to find that out teapot, haven't yet found a definitive source. Doesn't seem to be much heated pool experience so far...but our pool guy comes Saturday so I will ask him to ask around too.

I have time yet as a I won't install it until after the season has ended. Teapot does your friend ship to here?

Mouse
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teapot



Joined: 23 Oct 2013
Posts: 762
Location: Loire valley

PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2016 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I will find out Mousie but I am sure it can be done easily these days. I am shipping stuff around quite a lot and the only barrier is cost.
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Mouse



Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Posts: 7104
Location: Balearics

PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2016 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks!

Mousie
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Old Bill



Joined: 14 Nov 2014
Posts: 54
Location: Cessenon-sur-Orb, France

PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2016 8:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Teapot, it's kind of you to inquire. The pool heater is a Hayward 15kW Energyline Pro. Its energy consumption is 3.13 kW.
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Ele



Joined: 10 Nov 2014
Posts: 88
Location: Moraira, Costa Blanca, Spain

PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2016 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marketing a heated pool will definitely attract additional rentals all year round - most of our October through May bookings (8-10 weeks a year) will have booked because of it, or certainly it was a factor in their initial enquiry.

We do charge a fixed supplement to cover the electric cost - though it's difficult to assess exactly what that cost is as it depends on so many variables (such as the air temperatures ie how hard the pump has to work, and whether the guests keep the cover on when not in use). Guests understand the rationale for a supplementary fee - and I think a supplement is fairer than including it in the rental, as that would disadvantage those guests that choose not to use it. When considering a fee, bear in mind that you may need several days to heat the pool from a standing start (our takes around 4 days), so for a one week booking you may need to run the pump for 11 days or longer if it was not in use beforehand.

Our heat pump is a Polytropic Master XM (15 kw) and cost 4.500 including installation 2 years ago. If you decide to have one shipped make sure it's a brand / model that has local service / support - just in case! This is our 2nd heat pump in 10 years, wouldn't be without it!
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