Internet Thermostats

Agencies and other headaches, keys and cleaners, running costs and contracts...in short, all the things we spend so much of our time doing behind the scenes.<br>
tchn
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Post by tchn »

Fixed IP used to be a problem with some wifi thermostats, like the old Heatmiser one, but recent models get round the problem, often by using the modem that plugs into the back of the router.
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petemcveigh
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Post by petemcveigh »

Thanks all. I had the 'back in the day' info stuck somewhere in my head re the need for a fixed IP but, as you say, the world has moved on.

I was thinking, particularly in Florida, that the not infrequent power outages during storms might cause IP re-addressing.

thanks again.
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tchn
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Post by tchn »

I've got a remote oil monitor and got an email saying that it hadn't communicated with the server yesterday and it still hasn't... now wondering about all the things that may have gone wrong...broadband down?modem broken/unplugged by guests? battery gone in transmitter? whole oil tank seized by alien craft?? To think I got it to stop me worrying...
Essar
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Post by Essar »

tchn wrote:I've got a remote oil monitor and got an email saying that it hadn't communicated with the server yesterday and it still hasn't... now wondering about all the things that may have gone wrong...broadband down?modem broken/unplugged by guests? battery gone in transmitter? whole oil tank seized by alien craft?? To think I got it to stop me worrying...
Huh, alien craft - I don't think so, they run on dialithium crystals, why would they pinch your oil tank? Someones being pulling your leg!
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greenbarn
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Post by greenbarn »

Essar wrote:
tchn wrote:I've got a remote oil monitor and got an email saying that it hadn't communicated with the server yesterday and it still hasn't... now wondering about all the things that may have gone wrong...broadband down?modem broken/unplugged by guests? battery gone in transmitter? whole oil tank seized by alien craft?? To think I got it to stop me worrying...
Huh, alien craft - I don't think so, they run on dialithium crystals, why would they pinch your oil tank? Someones being pulling your leg!
You're out of date Essar. A recent article in the Alien Argus, or possibly the Daily Mail (can't remember for sure, but same thing anyway) described how aliens have developed a method of synthesising dialithium crystals from heating grade kerosene and leftover pizza. I now have a force field surrounding our oil tank. Unfortunately it blocks the oil level monitor signal, but whatever is in the tank is secure.
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kevsboredagain
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Post by kevsboredagain »

tchn wrote:Fixed IP used to be a problem with some wifi thermostats, like the old Heatmiser one, but recent models get round the problem, often by using the modem that plugs into the back of the router.
If you access any device on the internet, whether a heating controller or a camera, the IP address must be known. The traditional way is to have a fixed IP address but this is not liked by most ISPs and usually costs extra money.

The other way is for the device or the modem itself to report the current IP address to a server somewhere. This is generally referred to as a dynamic DNS. You then use a personal domain name on that server and it gives you the current IP address of the reporting device. Some devices include this service as part of the device cost but if not, it fairly cheap to buy this service on a yearly basis.

You'll find a dynamic DNS section in the setup of most modems/routers.

I think I pay $25/year for a dynamic IP service and this gives me unlimited domains, allowing access to all my internet connected devices at home, in France and in Spain.

Having remote access to the modem/router in your rental property is very useful, especially if you're off site. It lets you know not only that the internet is still working but obviously that the power if still on at the property! The status of any attached devices, such as heating controllers can also be viewed.
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petemcveigh
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Post by petemcveigh »

kevsboredagain wrote:
tchn wrote:Fixed IP used to be a problem with some wifi thermostats, like the old Heatmiser one, but recent models get round the problem, often by using the modem that plugs into the back of the router.
If you access any device on the internet, whether a heating controller or a camera, the IP address must be known. The traditional way is to have a fixed IP address but this is not liked by most ISPs and usually costs extra money.

The other way is for the device or the modem itself to report the current IP address to a server somewhere. This is generally referred to as a dynamic DNS. You then use a personal domain name on that server and it gives you the current IP address of the reporting device. Some devices include this service as part of the device cost but if not, it fairly cheap to buy this service on a yearly basis.

You'll find a dynamic DNS section in the setup of most modems/routers.

I think I pay $25/year for a dynamic IP service and this gives me unlimited domains, allowing access to all my internet connected devices at home, in France and in Spain.

Having remote access to the modem/router in your rental property is very useful, especially if you're off site. It lets you know not only that the internet is still working but obviously that the power if still on at the property! The status of any attached devices, such as heating controllers can also be viewed.
Cheers Kev, great explanation and advice. Many thanks.
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akwe-xavante
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Post by akwe-xavante »

Within the UK Internet Service Providers (ISP's) give domestic customers dynamic IP addresses. If you have a business account with your ISP then you may have a dynamic IP address but could be entitled to a FREE Fixed IP address without realising it as often they don't want you to have a fixed IP address by default. In this situation your given a FREE fixed IP address on request free.

Some ISP's will give customers with domestic accounts a fixed IP address on request and usually in one of two ways.

A one off payment typically £5 or £10 for the lifetime of the service your subscribing for, or typically a nominal monthly fee of usually £1 a month for the lifetime of the service your subscribing for.

Examples: TALKTALK used to up until at least Nov 2015 ask for an additional £1 a month (£12 a year)

PlusNet ask for a one off setup fee of £5 for a fixed IP address.

With Demon Internet a fixed IP address is standard.

Most modern systems and devices cope themselves with dynamic IP addressing problems but this isn't all that efficient at times and can cause temporary problems.

A fixed IP address is a great deal more reliable and much faster and efficient and can give you the option of doing other stuff with your properties.

CCTV, wildlife cameras, security systems, VPN connections, heating obviously.

Having a Fixed IP address can give you far far more with a lot more efficiency and reliability over DynDNS or other third party solution.

Having tried and used both scenarios I can say that having a fixed IP address is by far superior, secure, fast and efficient way of doing things and its not as expensive or as problematic as you may think.

A quick phone call to your ISP and ask about having a fixed IP address is very much worth it. For Free or a fiver or even up to say £25 a year it really is worth it.
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Post by russellt »

akwe-xavante wrote:
Some ISP's will give customers with domestic accounts a fixed IP address on request
I think they are a little reticent to do so because of the 4.3 billion limit of the IPv4 address standard. Yes, the world is running out of IP addresses! Therefore, everything has a price.

With the newer IPv6 standard, there will be something like 340 trillion, trillion, trillion available IP addresses. However, the move from v4 to v6 has been very slow. Only around 10% of IP addresses in use are v6, but companies like Apple are now making v6 a prerequisite for app developers.

Change is a-coming! :)
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kevsboredagain
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Post by kevsboredagain »

akwe-xavante wrote: A fixed IP address is a great deal more reliable and much faster and efficient and can give you the option of doing other stuff with your properties.

Having a Fixed IP address can give you far far more with a lot more efficiency and reliability over DynDNS or other third party solution.
.
Why so much faster and better? Having used Dynamic DNS for over 10 years, on over a dozen devices, in 4 countries, I've not experienced any of these speed or reliability issues.

The time taken to look up the IP address from a server is measured in milliseconds and after that you are talking to a known IP address using the same protocol as you would if it were a fixed IP address. How can there be any difference in performance?

For some of us there is little choice as the cost of a fixed IP address is prohibitive. My ISP here simply won't do them for residential customers and I cannot justify paying business rates. I'd imagine that most people on LMH are in exactly the same position. A single rental property would rarely justify a business internet tariff.
Last edited by kevsboredagain on Fri May 13, 2016 1:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
akwe-xavante
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Post by akwe-xavante »

Just my personnel experience.

When I have used a DynDNS services I've been unhappy with the unreliable sometimes unavailable service. Even worse when the IP address changes half way through a job, a break in a connection no matter how short can cause allsorts of potential problems.

DynDNS services are a third party service and the companies that provide it have there occasional bad day and loss of service. When a problem occurs thousands if not millions of devices are trying to resolve there IP addresses simultaneously afterwards and can result in denial of service for several minutes and longer.

DynDNS is just something else in the system that can go wrong

This is something I've never experienced with a fixed IP address.

If DynDNS is your only option then go for it but if there is an affordable (Sometimes even FREE) alternative such as a fixed IP address then this in my opinion is by far the best and most reliable option for me hands down.

My main business is IT and I've come across many a customer over years having DynDNS issues, all have been resolved with getting them a fixed IP address.

DynDNS does work and it is a solution to problem but getting a fixed IP address is by far a better solution based on over 23yrs experience. True I've come across a few that love and like DynDNS as a solution and it works for them, that's great but I've come many more that have had problems with it all fixed with a fixed IP address.

Some readers here have a dynamic IP address not knowing that they are entitled to a Fixed IP address FREE within there current contract with there ISP.

Some readers can get a fixed IP address free on request (Not Many though)

Some can get a fixed IP address for a one off payment of a Fiver

Others may have to pay an extra £1 a month or £12 a year.

Others will never get a fixed IP address from there ISP.

All readers have to do to find out is phone there ISP and ask rather than simply assume that because they currently have a dynamic IP address they can't have a fixed IP address.

The only UK ISP that I know of that does not give / offer a fixed IP address to domestic customers is Vodafone. Never been refused one from any other UK ISP, ok I / my customer's have chosen not to have one because of the cost on rare occasions.
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Post by jazzuk777 »

If anyone is still looking this week, various options have been on Amazon cyber monday deals - I bought the NetatMo at the weekend as it seems to be very easy to fit for £99.
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akwe-xavante
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Post by akwe-xavante »

Just thought I'd add to my last post here in May.

Two months ago I had a customer who was using a DynDNS service to access CCTV equipment at a remote chicken shed.

He was having problems accessing the equipment, sometimes it worked seamlessly sometimes not at all or it was intermittent.

A quick phone call to his UK ISP (Demon Internet) and he was given a fixed IP address for a one off payment of £5.

All his problems were solved, when I revisited for another reason last Thursday he was a very happy chappy.
tchn
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Post by tchn »

I finally bit the bullet and installed the heatmiser smart stat. I've been very pleased with it. It connects wirelessly directly to the router (not with a plug in modem) and does not use a static IP.
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