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tansy



Joined: 20 Sep 2004
Posts: 2106
Location: La Manche, Normandy, France

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 6:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Garri - great idea...my only enemy with this one is ....time!!

Running 3 houses, (with all the washing they produce), our own home with a constant stream of visitors to include 85 year old mother in law arriving for a month next week and 3 sets of friends for 3 different long weekends on the trot, 3 kittens (6 weeks old wrecking the house - can't find homes if anyone can help?), 3 dogs & 3 other cats, 4 acre garden, lots of friends popping in and out plus all the diversions living in France throws up as well...

Writing this has made me realise why I am so ...well put it like this I collapse into bed every night...can't remember reading a book for ages...I don't even have time for my Hello either now!
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Garri



Joined: 11 Jul 2005
Posts: 1717

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know what you mean about time - I'm having to get up earlier and earlier these days to cover ground, in peace and quiet, before the phone starts ringing at 9:30. (should I have put a full stop there? It looks weird after numerals. I guess it's OK though)

With regard Amazon, it's easy to set up and once done it's automatic. I'm sure Tony would oblige. Go on Tony, you know it makes sense!
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Garri



Joined: 11 Jul 2005
Posts: 1717

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony, I think the new ads look much better but would have rendered the headline in same colour as your links and blurb same colour as the main content text of the site.

Personally though, I prefer the wording of 'Sponsored links' rather than Gooooogle Ads.

This is a good example of blended in links, and also a neat tool with some useful tips:

http://www.adsensecalculator.com/

And also I'm trying to find an example I saw where the wording Gooogle Ads replaced with Sponsored links. I'm sure I've seen one on my travels.
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sticky



Joined: 15 Aug 2005
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well thanks for the welcome to the forum. I love the image of a Phantom of the Opera character stalking the Cotentin seeking revenge for some historic dire deeds. Unfortunately the image doesn’t fit. The other suggestion is closer.

Not that I am a competitor of Tansy’s – we don’t complete even if only because her gîte prices are three times higher than mine. My interest is in developing a professional image for the tourist industry in the Cotentin. I have invested everything I own in establishing my small businesses here in the Cotentin and, over the years, have been pleased to see that the quality of the products we offer has improved dramatically. There is still a dire shortage of good accommodation and I often find that I am searching in vain for somewhere to send enquirers. I have pointed people in Tansy’s direction (I think three times this season) although I doubt that it was helpful to either side as she would certainly have been booked. I need high quality, professional looking contact points to which I can refer people and this is why I pointed out a small proportion of the more obvious errors in the text.

My English may be letting me down (although I don’t think so) but it doesn’t strike me as ‘bitter’ to point out that that the offshore islands are the St Marcouf rather than plain Marcouf – an interested visitor might well want to look them up. He would not find them under M. They are listed under S in all the guides I checked. So, Renaud, perhaps the spelling is important – it is certainly courteous to the inhabitants to get the name of their home right (even if the inhabitants are all avian as in the St Marcouf islands). Pedantic perhaps but scarcely bitter. I can’t quite categorise my other comments as bitter either. As for ‘outburst’ – I think I know what the word means and find it very hard to apply it to my comments although it would be appropriate to some of the responses.

Dutch people have a directness of speech where the English often go all around the houses. I have little further interest in this forum as some members have made it clear that the purpose of offering sites for review is to attract favourable comment and emphatically not to have any mistakes pointed out. I have observed how other contributors have been subjected to personal attacks because they have made points (often cogently and persuasively) which do not fit the English sense of ‘niceness’. Keep it up Garri, don’t let them shout you down). Diversity can bring strength – or so the English have long claimed for their mongrel descent. And no, that is not meant as an anti-English comment – I don’t want racism added to the charge list.

One parting thought. The English often think that they own the English language. They don’t – they gave it to the world centuries ago. It would be very helpful if English writers of text remembered that their audience will not always have quite the same language that they do. Often ‘foreign’ readers will have a more grammatical and tighter perspective of the language – they learned it in school not on the streets and at home. If you are aiming at a native English audience then an act of communication will take place even if the language used is (UK) street English. This will not be the case when addressing an international audience. Writers need to think how non-native speakers will interpret the text. Peer review of publications is normal for academics and we learn early that the purpose of comment is to strengthen the product and that the comments are not personal. If you have faith in your product then have the courage of that conviction and accept improvements as such – after all my comments seem to have been incorporated in the text so perhaps I wasn’t entirely wrong. I am published in both French and English but am not good enough in either language to do without a good editor. I’m not good enough in any language to do without a good editor. I am a poor typist and atrocious speller so I expect to make many mistakes in my written work. I am pleased when these mistakes are pointed out because then my work has fewer errors. Perhaps some egos are a bit tender - and that is as close to a personal comment as I shall make - I leave that to others.

To underline my inability to type I have just posted this response in the wrong topic - I hope I have corrected it now.
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livinginitaly



Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 266
Location: Italy (at last!)

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sticky wrote:
Quote:
If you have faith in your product then have the courage of that conviction and accept improvements as such – after all my comments seem to have been incorporated in the text so perhaps I wasn’t entirely wrong.

Well, as I said in my reply to your initial post .... I have no problem with errors being pointed out, and promptly acted to make amendments. I even 'thanked you'.

Admittedly though, this was after a rather 'curt' response 'nay' accusation. However, this forum has suffered at the hands of people 'posting under pretense'. That said, I accept that my comments in this case were 'out of order' and once again I apologise.

I truly have no problems with taking critism, constuctive or otherwise. I do have problems with peoples 'tone of phrase' and this has caused confusion in the past, as often the words in our head suffer when translated onto a page.

I hope you do stay around, i'm sure you will make many useful contributions / observations to the forum.
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http://www.livinginitaly.co.uk
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tansy



Joined: 20 Sep 2004
Posts: 2106
Location: La Manche, Normandy, France

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ahhhhh...Dutch! I have a very close Dutch girlfriend here,(we're both in our 50's). Yes, she too is outspoken, (the South Africans are incredible!), but we fall about at times with her English and my dreadful French....but we both can laugh at it - I try not to take it too seriously - I know you Dutch do take things seriously...

I also write as I speak, (that probably is the Irish coming out in me), and you are correct - the English language is deteriorating - but at least it isn't as bad as American English (is that correct?),.....but wouldn't it all be easier if we could have spell check here - pretty please Paolo..I know you can spell!!! Laughing [/u]
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livinginitaly



Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 266
Location: Italy (at last!)

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Garri wrote:
Quote:
Tony, I think the new ads look much better but would have rendered the headline in same colour as your links and blurb same colour as the main content text of the site.

That'll be the 'inner me' rebelling against the 'blending in'!

I still have problems with this as I do honestly believe that people will consider the ads to be 'internal' links, in which case Tansy could lose 'genuine' customers.

My own opinion is that the colour scheme of ads should differentiate them from the site, whilst not 'clashing' with the overall colour scheme.

As for the 'Amazon page' ...... i'm all for that, even though it means adding another link to the menu and possibly causing 'ripples' that need to be 'fixed' thoughout the pages <shakes fist at garri>
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http://www.livinginitaly.co.uk
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tansy



Joined: 20 Sep 2004
Posts: 2106
Location: La Manche, Normandy, France

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sticky - forgot - Gite...is that not someone living on site/part of a property? I have holiday houses as I am no where near...or have I got that definition wrong?

Thank you for sending people over - I have availability in September in St Germain Sur Ay - Utah full until October.

If you are involved with Tourism..anything we can do about Britanny Ferries...the prices are unreal and they now openly admit they can charge what they like - this is a worry for all of tourism here...

But as one French person said to me the other day - ahhh when the weather has been good there are no houses for the young - holiday makers buy everything! So could this factor also be having an effect on visitor numbers here?

I know the 60th anniversary has had a big impact this year - people seeing it on the TV and want to see it for themselves.
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Alan Knighting



Joined: 18 Oct 2004
Posts: 4170
Location: Monflanquin, Lot-et-Garonne, France

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tansy,

Quote:
Sticky - forgot - Gite...is that not someone living on site/part of a property? I have holiday houses as I am no where near...or have I got that definition wrong?

I think the original is Gîte Rural, meaning self-catering cottage. The word Gîte has become generic in the same way as Hoover is for vacuum cleaner. Such is progress.

Regards

Alan
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la vache!



Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Posts: 11068

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tansy,
I have PM'd you re Brittany Ferries,
Susan
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enid



Joined: 27 Dec 2004
Posts: 5614
Location: Labretonie France

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I was teaching and working to help children give and receive criticism one method was to get them to say something they liked about the other person's work and something that would make it even better. This is what I try to do when I am giving feed back myself - although I don't stick to one point in each category!! When I put my web page up for the first time here it received a lot of negative criticism but couched in supportive tones which gave me the impetus to make a major redraft - the second time it was received much more positively and now I am working ondraft number 3 - slowly as like Tansy our summer days are very busy.

Sticky

Please don't leave the forum because of a diference of opinion -after all we are here to exchange opinions and we are bound to differ sometimes. Perhaps more detailed criticism comes a little easier from someone we have built a relationship with and I for one would appreciate getting to know you better. For example why Sticky?
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Renaud



Joined: 10 Aug 2005
Posts: 58

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 9:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welcome 'sticky', glad you rejoined the 'debate'. I must admit I found your initial post a bit sharp in tone, but I have to say, so were the responses. Personally I love a bit of 'lively' debate on a forum. And, yes, I too find too much 'niceness' a little...well, boring! Nothing wrong with being nice. But if it's all "nice, polite, ooh mustn't criticise" it all seems a bit pointless.

There's no reason why a vigorous debate can't be had without things turning nasty.

And Tansy would appear to me to be strong enough to take criticism and answer for herself. I would certainly try to tailor my criticism somewhat according to how sensitive I perceived the 'target' to be.
Your points about the English language are about right. Yes correct spelling is sometimes critical. The place name mis-spelling you quote is a perfect example.
I'm not so sure about your assertion that "Writers need to think how non-native speakers will interpret the text". If it's factual, technical text then certainly. But if it's fictional in nature then that is up to the writers personal preference. If they choose to make it "a difficult read", then that's their prerogative. But that's going a bit off topic.....

But please continue to post. Eloquent debate is always wanted.
Indeed, needed.
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enid



Joined: 27 Dec 2004
Posts: 5614
Location: Labretonie France

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Garri - new sandals? - quel bonheur - worn with socks or not?
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Renaud



Joined: 10 Aug 2005
Posts: 58

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Regarding spell checker software mentioned earlier. I think the following little poem highlights the shortcomings of such a beast. Please note that all the words it contains are correctly spelt.

Eye halve a spelling chequer
It came with my pea sea,
It plainly marques four my revue
Miss steaks eye kin knot sea.
Eye strike a key and type a word
And weight four it two say
Weather eye am wrong oar write
It shows me strait a weigh.

As soon as a mist ache is maid
It nose bee fore two long
And eye can put the error rite
Its rarely ever wrong.

Eye have run this poem threw it
I am shore your pleased two no
Its letter perfect in it's weigh
My chequer tolled me sew.

Boom, boom...
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tansy



Joined: 20 Sep 2004
Posts: 2106
Location: La Manche, Normandy, France

PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

are we sure Renaud is the right name Basil? Wink Wink
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