It seems like there are new rental listing sites being established on an almost weekly basis and it's hard to see how they can all make money. On the one hand, competition is a healthy thing, but on the other hand, there is a risk that increasing fragmentation of the market makes it harder to know where to advertise your holiday rental property.
I am interested in views of how the Rental Listing Site market will evolve : will it continue to fragment, possibly moving to a "pay per booking" model, or will there be consolidation ( in line with WVR's acquisition binge).
Thoughts ?
Thanks,
Kevin
The Future of Rental Listing Sites
My views, for what they're worth
One of the reasons for so many new sites is the availablity of software that can easily create this kind of product (like PHP forums) with fully automated owner log-in, password access (see mosets.com - hot property). I would guess a lot of them are run by people with other day jobs in IT trying to gain some extra cash through advertsing and goggle ads
I may be wrong but if they switch to free but paid for on bookings like villarenters they would become involved in the transaction as first contact of payment which would make them liable to any claims should anything go wrong - especially in the US. This would also push prices up as owners try and recoup the commission in the rates charged. I would guess these websites would need a hefty commission of 10%+ to make it replace revenue earned from advertising
Despite there being many sites, a lot are pretty useless and I would guess half the owners haven't paid for the ad. From comments on this forum many ads stay on after the subsription is cancelled. I think a lot of people stick to the same websites each year to find holiday homes so the established sites have the edge
I think with so many sites now, the 3 month free trial idea will become increasingly hard to sustain unless you are very confident of securing a booking for the owner.
One of the reasons for so many new sites is the availablity of software that can easily create this kind of product (like PHP forums) with fully automated owner log-in, password access (see mosets.com - hot property). I would guess a lot of them are run by people with other day jobs in IT trying to gain some extra cash through advertsing and goggle ads
I may be wrong but if they switch to free but paid for on bookings like villarenters they would become involved in the transaction as first contact of payment which would make them liable to any claims should anything go wrong - especially in the US. This would also push prices up as owners try and recoup the commission in the rates charged. I would guess these websites would need a hefty commission of 10%+ to make it replace revenue earned from advertising
Despite there being many sites, a lot are pretty useless and I would guess half the owners haven't paid for the ad. From comments on this forum many ads stay on after the subsription is cancelled. I think a lot of people stick to the same websites each year to find holiday homes so the established sites have the edge
I think with so many sites now, the 3 month free trial idea will become increasingly hard to sustain unless you are very confident of securing a booking for the owner.
I agree that the established sites have an edge. From research I have seen covering the larger US sites, the average length of time a "paying" owner stays is 3 years. However, with more competition, free trials are becoming almost mandatory to attract new owners and I suspect the amount of switching is increasing.
I also agree that there are logistical challenges with the pay per booking model, although if you could make it work, I think owners would pay (Eur 25-50 ?) for a booking.
Other views ?
Kevin
I also agree that there are logistical challenges with the pay per booking model, although if you could make it work, I think owners would pay (Eur 25-50 ?) for a booking.
Other views ?
Kevin
Employees aren't paid as they work according to orders or payments they generate - should they be? If not, why should web sites which don't work to promote individuals:they work to promote the site itself. The individual who pays per booking would be paying more to be on the site than the individual who is a poor "worker" and can't get the bookings. I expect to pay for a service, but not for my own good efforts.
Best,
Alexia.
Alexia.
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Giddy Goat
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Alexia,
I guess the counterpoint would be that the only reason you list on a site is to get bookings and ideally you should only pay for results. If the site doesn't generate any bookings, then you shouldn't have to pay to subsidise it.
I suppose there is an analogy with the comparison between newspaper advertising, which is typically a fixed price, regardless of results, and internet advertising, where you typically pay for results, either in the form of clicks, leads or sales ? Where there are a small number of advertising options (e.g. newspapers) , the fixed price model seems to dominate. However, where there are a plethora of options, the "pay for results" model seems to dominate. With the increasing number of rental listing sites, maybe this will move things towards the "pay for results" model ?
On the other hand, maybe with the increasing choices, owners will opt for the "safe bets" of the established sites. There was an interesting experiment done a few years ago in a small village in the north of England, where they gave everyone access to thousands of TV channels. Initially, people surfed broadly among the channlels, but they became almost over-whelmed with the choices. After a short period of time, most people came back to the local community channel !
Kevin
I guess the counterpoint would be that the only reason you list on a site is to get bookings and ideally you should only pay for results. If the site doesn't generate any bookings, then you shouldn't have to pay to subsidise it.
I suppose there is an analogy with the comparison between newspaper advertising, which is typically a fixed price, regardless of results, and internet advertising, where you typically pay for results, either in the form of clicks, leads or sales ? Where there are a small number of advertising options (e.g. newspapers) , the fixed price model seems to dominate. However, where there are a plethora of options, the "pay for results" model seems to dominate. With the increasing number of rental listing sites, maybe this will move things towards the "pay for results" model ?
On the other hand, maybe with the increasing choices, owners will opt for the "safe bets" of the established sites. There was an interesting experiment done a few years ago in a small village in the north of England, where they gave everyone access to thousands of TV channels. Initially, people surfed broadly among the channlels, but they became almost over-whelmed with the choices. After a short period of time, most people came back to the local community channel !
Kevin
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Giddy Goat
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Well Kevin, if it does go that way, hopefully the pricing will be calculated so that over a typical year, your also typical advertiser (you're going to tell me there's no such thing of course) still pays much the same as he/she currently does, or better still, less!
It may turn out OK for the likes of me, as the property, by and large, is only attractive to families, though I'm working on getting golfers down there. So for the moment I probably expect to get a max of say, 16 weeks booked pa. But the region is still largely unknown by the vast majority of visitors to France, so I have to put in quite a lot of effort to achieve those. Luckily, we do tend to get 2-week bookings, so, good news if one is paying per booking rather than per week booked.
I still think a system like this is messy. Most of us have a budget for advertising, and like the idea of a one-off payment at the start of the subscription.
We (speaking for myself!) creatures have small, but tidy minds.
It may turn out OK for the likes of me, as the property, by and large, is only attractive to families, though I'm working on getting golfers down there. So for the moment I probably expect to get a max of say, 16 weeks booked pa. But the region is still largely unknown by the vast majority of visitors to France, so I have to put in quite a lot of effort to achieve those. Luckily, we do tend to get 2-week bookings, so, good news if one is paying per booking rather than per week booked.
I still think a system like this is messy. Most of us have a budget for advertising, and like the idea of a one-off payment at the start of the subscription.
We (speaking for myself!) creatures have small, but tidy minds.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be
" ideally you should only pay for results. If the site doesn't generate any bookings, then you shouldn't have to pay to subsidise it. "
You don't expect a site to give you bookings: you pay a site to show your property in order to get enquiries. You get the bookings because you know how to present the property. If you don't get any enquiries you stop paying the site.
You don't expect a site to give you bookings: you pay a site to show your property in order to get enquiries. You get the bookings because you know how to present the property. If you don't get any enquiries you stop paying the site.
Best,
Alexia.
Alexia.
Jane,
I'm a tad worried by your concern for our olive trees. (We don't have a fence around them and they were severely eaten by a group of your cousins some years ago.) Please reassure me that you have no ulterior motive in asking after them. I'm not at all species-ist - I wouldn't mind if one of our children brought a goat home for dinner or even for the weekend - but there are limits.
To answer what I am (nearly) sure is your disinterested question: no, we haven't finished picking the olives. We're hoping our children will do it over Christmas.
BYW, our daughter saw an Edward Albee play in Paris last month, about a man who falls in love with a goat. This might be a little more open-minded than I am ready to be, but I would still try to welcome a goat-in-law.
ps Goats gather olives. People pick olives.
I'm a tad worried by your concern for our olive trees. (We don't have a fence around them and they were severely eaten by a group of your cousins some years ago.) Please reassure me that you have no ulterior motive in asking after them. I'm not at all species-ist - I wouldn't mind if one of our children brought a goat home for dinner or even for the weekend - but there are limits.
To answer what I am (nearly) sure is your disinterested question: no, we haven't finished picking the olives. We're hoping our children will do it over Christmas.
BYW, our daughter saw an Edward Albee play in Paris last month, about a man who falls in love with a goat. This might be a little more open-minded than I am ready to be, but I would still try to welcome a goat-in-law.
ps Goats gather olives. People pick olives.
Best,
Alexia.
Alexia.
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Giddy Goat
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Hi Alexia - you can rest easy - I do eat the occasional olive, but prefer other fruits on balance - though the more forbidden the better!
What a coincidence - we saw the very same play by Albee with our daughter a couple of weeks ago in Cambridge, where it was performed by students. It was extremely good, for those of you wondering how Albee came up with the plot, let alone how a production could be successfully staged without exciting serious interest from the police and the RSPCA! Though it did get me looking over my shoulder a bit afterwards.
I'm reassured to know that not many of the human species are that way inclined. It's generous of you however, Alexia, to be open to the idea at least, of admitting one of our kind into your family - in the unlikely event of such a liaison forming. This sentiment is entirely reciprocated. It sounds most respectable.
What a coincidence - we saw the very same play by Albee with our daughter a couple of weeks ago in Cambridge, where it was performed by students. It was extremely good, for those of you wondering how Albee came up with the plot, let alone how a production could be successfully staged without exciting serious interest from the police and the RSPCA! Though it did get me looking over my shoulder a bit afterwards.
I'm reassured to know that not many of the human species are that way inclined. It's generous of you however, Alexia, to be open to the idea at least, of admitting one of our kind into your family - in the unlikely event of such a liaison forming. This sentiment is entirely reciprocated. It sounds most respectable.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be
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Alan Knighting
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Giddy Goat
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Am I missing something here? Bookings. Inquiries. In the grand scheme of things, surely a site which generates lots of inquiries for you is more likely, statistically, to generate more bookings?
I know someone said that Perfect Places was a bit of an exception, since most inquiries, though fewer in number, quickly converted to bookings.
Explain please?
I know someone said that Perfect Places was a bit of an exception, since most inquiries, though fewer in number, quickly converted to bookings.
Explain please?
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be
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Alan Knighting
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Paolo, "If you don't get any enquiries you stop paying the site."
I was concerned with the issue of the amount to pay, not whether or not to pay. I stop paying a site if I don't get any enquiries - but I also stop paying if the enquirers don't book, because I think that different sites attract a different public (just as newspapers attract a different public).
So, no danger Paolo - happy holiday!!
(In these times of social unease I am maintaining a neutral approach to the festive season. Jane might like to know that Cronulla and Brighton beaches in her old feeding-ground - it was Sydney, wasn't it? - have been closed to goats of all persuasions. This, in the middle of summer.)
I was concerned with the issue of the amount to pay, not whether or not to pay. I stop paying a site if I don't get any enquiries - but I also stop paying if the enquirers don't book, because I think that different sites attract a different public (just as newspapers attract a different public).
So, no danger Paolo - happy holiday!!
(In these times of social unease I am maintaining a neutral approach to the festive season. Jane might like to know that Cronulla and Brighton beaches in her old feeding-ground - it was Sydney, wasn't it? - have been closed to goats of all persuasions. This, in the middle of summer.)
Best,
Alexia.
Alexia.