A22, Toll road April 2011

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Rogthedodge
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A22, Toll road April 2011

Post by Rogthedodge »

Good evening.

Has anyone a clue as to what is going on. Looked here and there but all comments seem to be different.

If it is to happen, which looks like it will. Do we inform our potential guests, do we pay it for them. The N125 is not really an option, is it?

Roger
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CSE
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Post by CSE »

These tolls were first set up in October 2010 in Northern part of Portugal. Next April they will be ready for use in southern Portugal.
Here is a link to one travel forum and I have contributed too the information.
You will unfortunately have to sift through some crap (like the poster from Canada or the person who was in the south last year and did not se these tolls). There has been a lot of information in the local Galician newspapers. It is about time Portugal woke up to this especially as it has already hit tourism in the north during winter month.
Let me know if you have any specific questions and I will try and answer them
http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/ ... 6190-2.cfm
Never try to out-stubborn your guests.
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Rogthedodge
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Post by Rogthedodge »

Wow, what can I say but total confusion. We are not out again until June so hopefully there will be more to read. But I have guests from the 12th April onwards, I feel obliged to keep them up to date. With what I ask myself..

Thanks very much for the information.

Roger
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CSE
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Post by CSE »

Tell them to contact their car hire company. There are several rumours about what is going to happen with hire cars.
One. they will have transponders added and the hirer will have to purchase a ticket.
Two, You can purchase a ticket without a transponder.
Do not use the Via Verdes with electronic only tolls.
In our local newspaper, I gave links to it on the forum, says that there should have been a special machine installed at Oporto airport. They used the singular and it has not been confirmed if there is one still. The toll system has now encircled the airport at Oporto.
I read that you can purchase tickets at a Post Office. But they do not have the same hours as airline services nor are they easy to find in a town or city. Maybe they are like Spanish ones and close from 2pm unless they are main ones covering a huge area (so few and far between).
I have read that Hungary also has a vignette system.
It seems to work ok from what I can find out on forums.
I am not going to Portugal until I can see a way through the mist, or take a normal tolled road.

http://www.motorway.hu/02Ematrica
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Rogthedodge
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Post by Rogthedodge »

Thank you casasan.. For interest I asked Economy care hire (who I use), they contacted Rent Auto and this is their reply, helpful not.

My advice is to buy a temporary dispositive called here as DT (Dispositivo Temporario), this DT is for sale at post offices (all main airports got one), and then clients must make a pre-payment of 10.00 Euros minimum, this value will be deduced each time the clients use the highway. The pre-payments can be made in any pin Machine – Cashier Machine, called here “Multibanco” or at any pay shop, and are valid for the period of 90 days. This DT is for sale at post offices and costs 27 Euros. In post offices clients can also find out how much money they have spent and if they need to made another pre-payment. Further information can be obtained at post offices.

So me or my guests have to buy a thingy at €27 and put €10 on it. I feel a no thankyou coming on.
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e-richard
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Post by e-richard »

Rather than copy/paste, there is a useful discussion here.

My contribution is on page 4 but still not definitive :cry:
** Richard
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CSE
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Post by CSE »

Richard. Thanks for that.
I posted way back in October on Slow travel about the tolls in the North.
http://slowtalk.com/groupee/forums/a/tp ... 9006232001
There is one Galician newspaper which we like to read on line as it is quite good on reporting these sorts of things. This is where I am getting my news from.
When do a search on the website for the newspaper only going back for one year there is something like 38 articles about the road tolls in the North. I have not posted every bit of news as some of it does not concern the holiday maker.
Never try to out-stubborn your guests.
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Post by e-richard »

Many thanks Ian and Irene - fascinating read, but for the poor holidaymaker, it just more additional confusing info :cry:


I'm heading out to Faro next week and hope to get a simple 3 bullet point statement for our guests - and, of course, I'll post it here too.

So far, the only fact that I know is that Via Verde tolls will start on the A22 on April 15th 2011.
** Richard
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Post by CSE »

Even with it operating here in the north for a few months facts are hard to obtain.
I do not want to drive down atoll road with out a card/ticket/ transponder to find out if I get a fine. I have tried the PO website up until I filled in my CC details. I used a genuine registration plate (from a car I imported into Spain from another EU country). That process worked.
Because I stopped the process I got an email from the PO website that no payment had been made and that I was not to use the toll road. I received that after the date of travel I filled in. Too late!!!

I will update the news on the forums I post on if and when I see something relevant to the tourist.


There is also confusion as to whether the scanners can recognise registration plates that are not Portuguese. I have read that the overheard scanners on the gantries can only read 2figs-2figs-2figs which is the form of the Portuguese plates. (It is also the same for the Dutch unless it is a very new car). But I have also read that when the scanners do not recognise a plate then it sends a signal to the police. There are meant to be extra police patrolling to catch and fine those flagged up. But like you say it all could be rumours.
Never try to out-stubborn your guests.
e-richard
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Post by e-richard »

From some of my reading, if you do not have the electronic device, I gather you can go into a post office (CTT) within 5 days of your travel and pay the toll over the counter.

There is an additional (unspecified) admin charge for doing it this way, but:

I have no idea if it applies to foreign vehicles as well or whether the email you got banning you from the highway was a result of trying and failing to pre-pay :roll:

I think its best if I stop posting half-hearted info..... will wait to see if anyone can get something definitive.
** Richard
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Tom Hart
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Post by Tom Hart »

I live here in Portugal in the Beiras area which as yet has no toll roads nearby.
However I do go to Porto airport occasionally, and both the A1 and the A29 now have tolls. We used to use the A29 as it was free, the A1 has had manned toll booths since we came here three years ago.
Since October 15th 2010 the A29 has the new electronic tolls, and on my last trip, in January the A1 toll booths are now automated, (not manned).
There has been considerable confusion and anger in Portugal over the introduction of the electronic tolls.
I started trying to obtain a Viaverde device to pay the tolls through my bank account in November, it actually arrived two weeks ago.
If you do not have a device, and you are driving a Portuguese plated car you are supposed to visit a post office within 5 days to pay the toll(s) plus a handling fee. Please note not ALL post offices have this ability, and the information is not available for 48 hours, after going through the toll.
Yes I know! If you are returning a hire car to the airport it is impossible to pay the toll!!!!
There are a number of options for visitors, none of which I am capable of explaining, because they make no sense whatsoever.

On my trip in January (using the A1 and paying the tolls) it was possible to get to Porto airport without passing through an electronic toll.
What will I be telling my visitors? I am really not sure!!!

On local Expat websites the current information is that the hire companies are doing little or nothing about this. I can only imagine that they will use the customer's credit card to pay the fine!

NOT GOOD FOR BUSINESS.
e-richard
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Post by e-richard »

Tom Hart wrote:On local Expat websites the current information is that the hire companies are doing little or nothing about this. I can only imagine that they will use the customer's credit card to pay the fine!.
One little snippet I did pick up is that Car hire companies will NOT be expected to pay the fine. They will simply have to supply the name and address of the hirer.

So, then what happens ?

I'd love to suggest that all holidaymakers then ignore these foreign demands - it might make the authorities wake up to tourism.
** Richard
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Post by CSE »

Tom, many thanks for coming here and posting this. At last I have seen some ones experience of what car hire companies are doing about this. it is just as I thought nothing. :(

Richard
So far as I can make out if you pick up any fines be it parking right through to say speeding in a hire car your CC is normally deducted the relevant amount, sometimes plus costs of the hire company.

If we know if our guests are coming from or going to Portugal we are informing them of these tolls. One guest has already changed plans. They were driving their German registered car.
Never try to out-stubborn your guests.
Tom Hart
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Post by Tom Hart »

Hello Richard,
My understanding was the same as Ian's, if any fine is picked up in a hire car they charge the credit card. However I can quite believe that the Portuguese will attempt to do it differently! It is worth mentioning that a friend in an English registered car went up the A29 to Porto and back, late October and has yet to hear anything. Also my Portuguese teacher forgot to go to the Post Office in November to pay tolls within 5 days, she has not heard anything either.
The big problem is that it will not be good for visitors to the country, and any problems so far are likely to be dwarfed when it comes into effect on the Algarve road.
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Rogthedodge
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Post by Rogthedodge »

Gracious me what an information highway, thank you all. I know we are still not clear but I am not on my own looking.

Richard, I am sure we all look forward to your return and update.

Rgds

Roger
Deary me am I real.

www.holiday-rentals.com/52179
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