Well i see this as a massive problem.
In the usual arrangement a percentage is paid as a deposit
and then several weeks before the clients arrival the remainder is
paid along with a damage deposit. What happens with HL AND
CANCELLATIONS/keeping owners informed on this?
What happens re damage deposits?
It is all very messy, disorganised and a touch one sided.
OH said .....and what if H Lettings suddenly shuts up shop and takes a long holiday?
HL pay their owners 2 days after the arrival of the clients
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croatian_villa
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This is the way the market is going. Airbnb, Housetrip, HL and many others take the payment from the client and transfer it to you 2 days after the client arrives. It makes the client feel safe!
I think we're going to have to move with the times. A few years ago I wouldn't have considered commission payments but now I'm happy to accept if it brings in the clients. I've experienced no problems so far.
Debby
I think we're going to have to move with the times. A few years ago I wouldn't have considered commission payments but now I'm happy to accept if it brings in the clients. I've experienced no problems so far.
Debby
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salmoncottage
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Fair point Apexblue, Jessops, Comet, HMV and countless other respected and trusted companies have recently gone that way when few ever would have thought it possible. They cant even guarantee to honour their own gift vouchers let alone refund customers deposits.
'Oh, I do like to be beside the seaside'
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Sam V
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Blimey, just think on that one. Clients in your property for 2 days already and you don't get paid. And.... What if you have a number of forward bookings? Far as the client is concerned they'd have already paid to stay but you're not going to see a penny?apexblue wrote:What happens if the company go bump?
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www.algarvevillatrinity.co.uk
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dont mess in the affairs of cats for they are subtle and will p on your computer.
www.algarvevillatrinity.co.uk
www.facebook.com/villatrinity
www.gardenerscottage.promotemyplace.com
My main concern about this issue is different, it regards what will happen if a guest decides to try to get his money back while enjoying free holidays. I have expressed that concern to HL and they haven´t reassured me sufficiently.
HL may go out of bussiness of course but so can local agents (or worse, they could run away with the money).
HL may go out of bussiness of course but so can local agents (or worse, they could run away with the money).
Firstly, what if the company goes bump?
If this business model is to succeed, then the rental companies are going to have to hold the funds in a separate Escrow account.
I would not be surprised if they don't do this already because it will not be long before legislation comes along to force it.
Are you suggesting that if the guest "complains" to the rental company, then they will just refund the money without reference to the owner; no questions asked ?
These are multi-million $$ companies we're talking about. They may frequently be inefficient, but I doubt they're deliberately that fraudulent.
If this business model is to succeed, then the rental companies are going to have to hold the funds in a separate Escrow account.
I would not be surprised if they don't do this already because it will not be long before legislation comes along to force it.
I don't get this ?Alvaro wrote:My main concern about this issue is different, it regards what will happen if a guest decides to try to get his money back while enjoying free holidays.
Are you suggesting that if the guest "complains" to the rental company, then they will just refund the money without reference to the owner; no questions asked ?
These are multi-million $$ companies we're talking about. They may frequently be inefficient, but I doubt they're deliberately that fraudulent.
** Richard
PIMS: Holiday Rental Management system
They say we learn from our mistakes. That makes me a genius !
PIMS: Holiday Rental Management system
They say we learn from our mistakes. That makes me a genius !
By charging a commission on a booking that came through their site HL are effectively acting as an agent; the fact is they are only actually charging a commission for collecting the payments from the guests and not providing any other service to them. They do provide a booking system for the owner to use but nothing else.
They are very clear (in their Ts & Cs) that they are merely acting as a payment collection agent and not a travel agent or holiday provider; that the contract for the chosen property is between the property owner and the guest and definitely not them.
Here lies several problems:
1. How can they charge a booking commission to the guest for nothing more than keeping hold of the owners' cash until after the guest arrives - not much of a service for 5% when a credit card payment already has a similar chargeback safeguard.
2. Although, FlipKey state that the funds they keep are in Escrow I can't find anything to match it from HL - so are the owners' funds kept in a "client account" in Escrow separate from HLs own dosh (and legally done so, not just said so) like what solicitors have to do? Are they using an Escrow service through their bankers?
3. I can't for the life of me understand why this delayed payment system is so essential to them. It would work just as well if the deposits were paid immediately to owners and the balance only paid on the day the guests arrive. Keeping it all is wrong unless you really are an agent and take the legal responsibilities that other agents do; like Sawday, Hoseasons, etc., and apply and die by their terms for the services they provide for both owner and guest.
4. Many owners rely upon the deposits for cash flow purposes and this would be a deal breaker for many owners if they only use HL for advertising. For those of us using several different methods it may not be, but it is still very unsatisfactory.
5. The amount of owners' cash that HL will have on account once this system becomes the norm will run into millions, very unsettling.
6. There is a clear conflict of interests in HLs acceptance of an owners' terms and conditions of trading for the contract between the owner and the guest that excludes the owners own cancellation terms. By insisting that HLs' cancellation terms are the only terms acceptable they are breaking their own rule regarding the "contract exists between the property owner and guest and doesn't include HL" concept.
The whole thing is like the recent software upgrades; ill-though out and ill-applied - a recipe for disaster when something goes wrong (and it will with 75,000 properties in their portfolio).
I suggest you keep away until the S*** hits the fan and the aftereffects are incorporated into the concept properly.
For 3% you are potentially gonna get yourself into a lotta trouble at some point.
Now, I do believe that this is the way forward and it will provide owners with a better control of costs and advertising, you'll be able to turn on and off an advert when you want to and have a fixed fee per booking instead of an annual fee for all bookings.
However, the unacceptable nature of the terms that it is being arbitrarily introduced under make it unsafe to use, bad for cash flow (remember it's our cash not HLs) and the terms it operates under probably legally unenforceable.
They are very clear (in their Ts & Cs) that they are merely acting as a payment collection agent and not a travel agent or holiday provider; that the contract for the chosen property is between the property owner and the guest and definitely not them.
Here lies several problems:
1. How can they charge a booking commission to the guest for nothing more than keeping hold of the owners' cash until after the guest arrives - not much of a service for 5% when a credit card payment already has a similar chargeback safeguard.
2. Although, FlipKey state that the funds they keep are in Escrow I can't find anything to match it from HL - so are the owners' funds kept in a "client account" in Escrow separate from HLs own dosh (and legally done so, not just said so) like what solicitors have to do? Are they using an Escrow service through their bankers?
3. I can't for the life of me understand why this delayed payment system is so essential to them. It would work just as well if the deposits were paid immediately to owners and the balance only paid on the day the guests arrive. Keeping it all is wrong unless you really are an agent and take the legal responsibilities that other agents do; like Sawday, Hoseasons, etc., and apply and die by their terms for the services they provide for both owner and guest.
4. Many owners rely upon the deposits for cash flow purposes and this would be a deal breaker for many owners if they only use HL for advertising. For those of us using several different methods it may not be, but it is still very unsatisfactory.
5. The amount of owners' cash that HL will have on account once this system becomes the norm will run into millions, very unsettling.
6. There is a clear conflict of interests in HLs acceptance of an owners' terms and conditions of trading for the contract between the owner and the guest that excludes the owners own cancellation terms. By insisting that HLs' cancellation terms are the only terms acceptable they are breaking their own rule regarding the "contract exists between the property owner and guest and doesn't include HL" concept.
The whole thing is like the recent software upgrades; ill-though out and ill-applied - a recipe for disaster when something goes wrong (and it will with 75,000 properties in their portfolio).
I suggest you keep away until the S*** hits the fan and the aftereffects are incorporated into the concept properly.
For 3% you are potentially gonna get yourself into a lotta trouble at some point.
Now, I do believe that this is the way forward and it will provide owners with a better control of costs and advertising, you'll be able to turn on and off an advert when you want to and have a fixed fee per booking instead of an annual fee for all bookings.
However, the unacceptable nature of the terms that it is being arbitrarily introduced under make it unsafe to use, bad for cash flow (remember it's our cash not HLs) and the terms it operates under probably legally unenforceable.
"Write something, even if it's just a suicide note"
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"There is no human problem which could not be solved if people would simply do as I advise"
"As for my amnesia, I've had it as long as I can remember"
Real name: Steve
Gender: Male
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Hells Bells
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oasiscouple
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If you just do some theoretical sums, say 25,000 properties use the system with say 2 weeks let at say £800 per week, total £1600 (that’s 40 million quid) held for say 2 months at say 2%pa interest, that’s 133 thousand quid in interest just for 2 weeks booking. So think what the sums could be for a whole season of bookings. Mind you, you have to set this off against the loss of 25,000 properties not paying the £250 per year advert fee, i.e. over 6 million quid. Whatever, it has to be a commercial move on their part. Certainly not for me. I want to see the money coming into my French bank in Euros with no exchange rate risks before my guests arrive.lorca wrote:
Aren´t they making a tidy sum in interest while all that dosh sits in their bank accounts?
Ditto everything Essar says above.
We were invited to reinstate our lapsed ad for *free* but could not find anything in the small print to indicate how or where rental monies will be held, how exchange rates will be applied, what happens to the security deposit in the event of a dispute, where the responsibility lies in the event of yet another glitch in the HL system etc etc etc.
Given the mess with basics like advertising the correct rental prices, we simply feel unable to trust the HL commission-based system at present.
Struggle to understand yet applaud the courage of anybody who is already doing so
We were invited to reinstate our lapsed ad for *free* but could not find anything in the small print to indicate how or where rental monies will be held, how exchange rates will be applied, what happens to the security deposit in the event of a dispute, where the responsibility lies in the event of yet another glitch in the HL system etc etc etc.
Given the mess with basics like advertising the correct rental prices, we simply feel unable to trust the HL commission-based system at present.
Struggle to understand yet applaud the courage of anybody who is already doing so
+1Chippy wrote:Ditto everything Essar says above.
We were invited to reinstate our lapsed ad for *free* but could not find anything in the small print to indicate how or where rental monies will be held, how exchange rates will be applied, what happens to the security deposit in the event of a dispute, where the responsibility lies in the event of yet another glitch in the HL system etc etc etc.
Given the mess with basics like advertising the correct rental prices, we simply feel unable to trust the HL commission-based system at present.
Struggle to understand yet applaud the courage of anybody who is already doing so