Lay My Hat

I have written on my website on the reservations and bookings page

When Booking directly we ask that you request our terms & conditions before confirming as cancelations charges will apply

So if a guest or prospective guest wants to see a copy of my Terms and Conditions i will send a copy by PDF on a separate e mail as it runs into a few pages

this apply to direct bookings only as if booked through one of the many booking portals the T’s & C’s associated with that portal will apply unless stated otherwise

however i have a scenario with a guest that should have stayed in August for a week the reservation was confirmed on the 22 June they asked if they could pay in cash on arrival ? to avoid transfer costs i do not normally do this but i agreed on this occasion.

After various e mail correspondence giving me names ,address etc … and agreeing an arrival time etc…. as they were coming from the middle of the UK and saying they were looking forward to there 1st time in Germany etc etc .

on the 3rd August i get an e mail “ due to family problems they will not be able to come “ they were due to arrive on the 9th

i agreed to open the dates on my booking calendar and if i was able to re let the dates i would not charge a cancelation fee or charge pro rata bearing in mind an agreement was made to pay on arrival !!!!

however i was unable to let the dates and the apartment remained empty as i had no further correspondence from them i sent an e mail with an invoice for payment i explained as the dates we not re let i am requesting payment in full and i am happy to provide any documentation for insurance claims etc …

i had no reply for about 5 days then an e mail arrived stating that the reason for the cancelation was that a family member was taken ill ( presumably at deaths door ) and they could not possibly have come on the holiday given the circumstances …….

i replied i was sorry to hear about the news ( in my usual sympathetic business like reply trying to sound caring while my business head is wondering how much truth is in the cancelation reason … call me cynical ) however if they can make a point at the nearest opportunity ( given time as not sure the complexity of the illness )to attend to the outstanding invoice
and happy to provide documents for insurance etc…

then it all went quite !!!

so i allowed a few days then drafted a letter repeating formally my request for payment with a copy of payment terms and invoice given them until today to respond i sent the letter registered so someone at the address had to sign for

and low and behold last night i received an e mail

Further to your letter dated ****** which I received today, I was not made aware of your cancellation policy and you seemed very eager to get me booked in when you had a supposed 'cancelled booking' originally when you booked me in only a couple of weeks before the stay. As you were probably aware, the transport links to the holiday cottage are poor and this was never mentioned when you booked me in at short notice, because of this there was no transport options available to us and with a family death, this was not a viable holiday and had I been aware of the transport issues and your terms and conditions, I would never have let you book us in for the cancelled slot. Having spoken to citizens advice bureau, it is your job as the holiday provider to state all the facts and provide a written copy of any terms and conditions, I received no such documents. I am appalled at how I have been treated by yourselves and feel that if this is pursued, I will have to contact relevant tourist sites to tell people how threatening you have been towards me, verging on bullying.

I look forward to your response within the next 7 days before I take further action

the was no supposed cancellation booking the dates were changed by them on negotiation as their original date choice was booked
transport links poor ??? this baffles me the house has not moved since they made the enquiry it is in Germany on the Moselle & they are travelling from the UK ….. oh i get it they are blaming me for the Calais problems !!!!
Booked at short notice !!! confirmed on the 22 June to stay in August Emmm ! who enquired about the possibility to stay at my property
And finally pulling the usual blackmail trick “ the Review or slating me over social media “ if bullying is a property owner asking for payment for a holiday booked .. well i am lost for words the only thing i should have been tougher on was requesting payment in advance ( or does that count as threatening or bullying ) and not publishing my T’s & C’s in full on my website just for information my T’s & C’s say payment must be 6 weeks before arrival or in the case of last minute on booking !!!!
oh and i am not a holiday provider “ CAB “

rant over now to think of a reply ….. “ to avoid further action “

mental note for next time
payments in advance
re publish T ’s & C’s with tick box

With no financial commitment what did you really expect, honesty and integrity?
I feel you should have as a lot of us do a T&C's check box so the booking form cannot be sent without it. No actual need for potential guests to have read it but that's their look out.

As for them demanding a response in 7 days, that's rubbish as they are on a thin line I doubt very much they would b foolish enough to want to go to arbitration where you are quite likely to get 50% of your money or more

Sorry this has happened but as teapot says you need to tighten up your booking procedure. No booking should proceed if your terms haven't been made clearly available. I have a tick box too and have them published on my website so they are viewable at all times. On the rare occasions online form isn't filled in, I get a statement from the guest that they agree to the terms.

Payment; if not taken in advance I think it's unrealistic to expect people to send money after the event. B&Bs and hotels take credit card details and can charge the first night if you don't turn up.

I keep it simple - No money, no stay.

IANAL, so this could be rubbish (but at least you won't get charged for it ) but certainly in this instance I don't believe the absence of signed, or acknowledged in any other way, T&Cs is relevant. You had a contract in place; I suppose a valid consideration is the country under whose laws the contract was made, which might have some bearing. Within the UK, the contract would be governed by UK Contract Law which will make certain reasonable assumptions (and ignore any T&Cs, signed or not) which would include neither party making a loss or profit from a cancellation by the other party. Hence it was up to you to attempt to mitigate your loss by trying to re-let - which you did, without success. You are still entitled to recover all your losses, which is the rental fee less any expenditure you didn't have to incur such as cleaning, electricity etc. That AIUI is the position; whether you'd succeed or whether it's worth the effort is for you to decide.
The guest who is in breach of contract is trying to blow smoke with the other claims - and probably weakening his/her case by switching to a different reason for cancelling.
As I said, I have no legal knowledge, but too many people assume too much about the presence or absence of T&Cs.

Greenbarn, you may well be technically right, but you still won't get money out of a guest as described above.

e-richard wrote:Greenbarn, you may well be technically right, but you still won't get money out of a guest as described above.

Agreed! Unless it was really worth the effort of using the Small Claims Court.
Point is that it makes no difference what the T&Cs said or whether they were signed in blood, or non-existent - the chances of getting the money legitimately due are, unfortunately, the same.
Essar sums it up succinctly - he does do simple well!

Thanks all for your input , I am half way completing a response to the so called guest wording it very carefully I don't hold out much hope to recover the rental costs however I am not going to rollover and be held to ransom over the possability of being falsely slated over the WWW my reply will finish open ended with asking them for a fair solution which should be interesting
So yes I trusted them to pay on arrival after many exchanges of correspondence ..... I hold my hands up to that
But it is amazing how people change their attitude when you ask them to conclude their side of the contract
Still it will teach me to be so trusting in future ....I will just have to tighten my policies

I agree. Not worth the fight. Next time, take a substantial deposit (I have done cash on arrival in the past at the U.S. house as I was local but never without a deposit.) Also, I did have a cancellation due to a death in the family. I kept the deposit. I sent a condolence card and offered to apply it to a future stay...and he did the next year...and wrote a lovely review and became a repeat guest. So...I guess the moral is, take a deposit, stick to your terms...but also be compassionate and try and keep your customer I think.

Essar wrote:I keep it simple - No money, no stay.

Ditto

Sorry you have been taken advantage of here.
I think the guests would have thought longer and harder about not coming on holiday if they had paid 50% of the cost. I also agree with Greenbarn that's the fact they are now throwing other claims up such as transport issues is further evidence they are making excuses for not coming and TRYING to add weight to their case (but in fact weakening it by deviating from the original reason given for cancelling).
None of which helps you but it's another lesson learned.
I always assume the worst in people and am then pleasantly surprised when they turn out good 😀

As I see it, this man owes you but he has no intention of paying you. Forget about his excuses, real or imagined, my thoughts are that you have right on your side in theory and legally. Practically, however, your chances of getting paid IMO are very slim and not without an uphill battle, the cost of which would likely outweigh the rent you have missed out on.

Regarding anyone's terms and conditions, they are part of the contract (the most important part generally speaking), but only if they are introduced before a contract is concluded. The best proof of this is requiring the renter to tick the "I have read the t's and c's" box on a booking form, or as part of the "Book Now" process.

Just posting your t's and c's on your website or wherever and leaving it at that, does not mean that your renter has read them or accepted them so IMO they won't count if called on. I confess that I am guilty of just that, so a renter from me can get away with blue murder.

Do all these recent posters realise that we're talking about an episode that happened 6 months ago ?

e-richard wrote:Do all these recent posters realise that we're talking about an episode that happened 6 months ago ?

So, four months later....?

It might be an old subject so I thought I'd look at the website to see how the booking procedure has changed. All it keeps saying is that a guest must accept the terms and conditions. But what are they? Where are they? What are the payment terms?