Lay My Hat

I have got photos of how they left the property but i don't think its advisable to use them in any response letter, unless they take it further.

Oh and forgot to add they also left a window wide open upstairs and the back door wide open and when they cleaner called them on the phone on the Monday, they admitted they would leave the property in a terrible mess, because thats the way they found it!

Personally and as i have said before, this isn't my property, but if it was mine I would actually pay a solicitor to write a letter, because i would be so angry with the way they have behaved.

I think some of you are missing the point with Trip Advisor. I have been so anti it for so long, but i have to to live with it and i try my best to work with it when i can, but we mustn't forget how different we are to Hotels.

We market holiday Cottages and the most reviews we could get in a year is 52! and thats if we are booked for 52 weeks a year. I follow up every guest after they have left with a detailed feedback form as its great to find out of any minor issues or improvements that can be made. At the end of the form we ask if they are willing to fill in a Trip Advisor review. 40% of those bookings say they will.

So i send i link via the Trip Advisor website and only 5% of the 40% can be bothered to write a review!

How can you say that is balanced set of reviews and if one guest is hell bent on revenge or blackmail and write a review, it causes no end of damage and it could take months and months to get the good reviews to counteract the damage. Hotels have 100's of guests a week, so 1 bad review can be balanced out with many positive.

Frankly the whole system of reviews stinks and I can't wait for the day that someone does something about this ridiculous way of rating properties!!

Frankly the whole system of reviews stinks and I can't wait for the day that someone does something about this ridiculous way of rating properties!!

Like what? Forces people to be silent? This genie isn't going back in the bottle.

BUT, it doesn't matter - really. One shitty review really doesn't matter. Rants are obvious, and people look for trends. All properties (with sufficient reviews) have a few shitty reviews, it's just life, and people accept that.

The days of a published catalogue, with no customer reviews, being handed out by agencies and tourist boards are over. The days of "we speak at the customer" are over. Customers have a voice, and that isn't going away.

Honestly, I realise you're upset, but that really doesn't help matters. Just let TripAdvisor know a blackmail review might be coming, and they'll deal with it.

As for social media - despite the fanfare at the time, most social media activity comes to very little and is quickly forgotten. A few days everyone on Facebook and Twitter was bitching about Andrew Lloyd Webber, but his musicals still go on. The memory of social media anger is quite short.

annafern wrote:Frankly the whole system of reviews stinks and I can't wait for the day that someone does something about this ridiculous way of rating properties!!

I couldn't agree with you more. The problem isn't the odd bad review, it's all the other bad reviews that we might have had, had we not dealt with complaints in a way that unjustifiably appeases. On numerous occasions I have not charged guests for damage etc, when it was fully justified, just because the value of the damage was less than the damage that a bad revenge review could do. And that's just wrong. I've been threatened in the past with a bad review if money is not forthcoming and sadly it is happening all too often IMO. Thankfully media reporters are picking up on the review circus, and I believe the government are considering regulation. Bring it on, I say.

Good on Airbnb for redressing the balance in allowing guests to be reviewed too. I believe this makes reviews far more fair and measured.

annafern wrote:Oh and forgot to add .... when they cleaner called them on the phone on the Monday, they admitted they would leave the property in a terrible mess, because thats the way they found it!

If I'd seen that before, I'd have looked at this issue VERY differently.

Instead of £50 compensation, I'd just totally ignore them.

By the way, was there any security deposit ?

You still haven't read my response correctly and not sure Edinburgh if you own or manager holiday cottages yourself.

Fine for Hotels as I said good reviews outway one or two bad comments, but for us! at the most we have 1 guests a week who might or might not leave a review. how can that be fair!

We as holiday property owners/managers need to have different type of review system

Thankfully media reporters are picking up on the review circus, and I believe the government are considering regulation. Bring it on, I say.

I don't want to give the impression I'm not sympathetic, but really, what exactly would you expect the government to do?

Ban all review sites? If yes - then what of sites hosted outwith their jurisdiction?

Insist review sites do something? If so, what?

At the end of the day, anyone can stick a website online, and very little can be done to remove it - indeed, I would suggest censorship attempts cause a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect whereby people who previously didn't pay that much attention to them will want to see what the lowdown is.

I would be curious as to what reforms you'd suggest, and how you think these reforms might impact on freedom of speech, and how these proposed reforms might be affected by different jurisdictions.

annafern wrote:You still haven't read my response correctly and not sure Edinburgh if you own or manager holiday cottages yourself.

Why yes, I do.

annafern wrote:We as holiday property owners/managers need to have different type of review system

Whether you need one or not is irrelevant: you'll get what the Internet gives you.

I realise you'll not like my reply, and may see me as being argumentative - but I'm just laying the fact out there. It doesn't matter whether self-catering owners like the review system or not, it is here to stay.

If you've got a solution to silencing a system whereby anyone can post anything they like, then sure, go ahead.

Frankly, I'd love to see how UK Gov would plan to silence a review system operated in Russia, China, or any of the other second world dives in which I could get a virtual server for a few quid a month

My point isn't to antagonise, but to point out that this is the system that's popular. You can either waste energy stressing about it, or accept it.

The third option is to invent something better and hope that people migrate to it, but, since people love a platform for their own voice (much like me on this thread, eh!), I can't see reviews being superseded.

I dislike TripAdvisor, too. But it's there whether we like it or not, and if you think these lovely guests might go down that route I really would get your retaliation in first.

Instructions and advice here: https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/TripAdvis ... mmediately

If you do that then at least you've flagged the issue and you've made an effort to mitigate any potential harm.

I was looking for a cheap one night hotel/guest house around Coventry for a meeting I have to attend. The reviews as said by Edinburgh form a pattern despite one or two being different.

One place had 270 something reviews, (trip advisor) 240 of them were bad saying avoid this place! How come it still gets bookings? and afterwards people vent their spleen with the other 240 saying avoid.

Naturally I have avoided it and booked elsewhere. It just goes to show somewhere with that many complaints still gets booked.

The important part is the response, if that maintains a level headed statement people will understand but if there is any money going back to these idiots then they are making a monkey out of someone.

The fairest thing would be to allow owners to post reviews of their guests - and if you have evidence of a trashed or damaged property it would be there for all to see. On some sites you are able to counter comments with a reply but that should be an option for all reviews.

I would certainly contact TA to advise them of the threat of a bad review. I'd then be responding to the guest explaining that because of the appalling state in which they left the place - and you have evidence to prove that - there was a hefty fee for the extra cleaning that needed to be done, including special laundering of the towels they claim not to have had but managed to leave covered in excrement (as I understand it!) In view of that cost, while you are sorry the welcome pack was missed due to an oversight - or whatever - you are not able to offer compensation for it as the cost was less than you had to pay for the cleaning and laundry.
Yes, bad reviews are very damaging to a small business but if you alert TA immediately, both to the threats (of a bad review and of leaving the place in a mess) and the state in which the place was left, I don't think you or the owner should allow yourselves to be held to ransom by people like this. Sometimes we just have to stand up for ourselves and say NO.

This has to be the only way as it leaves all the rhetoric and emotion to one side.

Marks wrote:let them carry out their threat and then respond factually and without emotion

annafern wrote:I have got photos of how they left the property but i don't think its advisable to use them in any response letter, unless they take it further

IF it did go further, you'd almost certainly be wasting your time playing email/letter tennis with $cumbags like these. Couple of others have asked if any security deposit was paid? I would think however you (or owner) have dealt with that deposit is key in terms of where you're at with this right now.

IF they do post the neg review I'd put a few factual bullet points to TA and ask them to take it down as not much else you can do?

Legally (e.g. Libel) I can see a couple of obstacles that may make it unworkable...

(i) to make photos count in any legal sense you'd need to be able to prove their accuracy (e.g. before versus after, date/time they were taken etc).

(ii) the plaintiff (owner) would need to be able to prove they had suffered some damage to their business/reputation as a direct result of the review

annafern wrote:I think some of you are missing the point with Trip Advisor. I have been so anti it for so long, but i have to to live with it and i try my best to work with it when i can, but we mustn't forget how different we are to Hotels.

annafern wrote:only 5% of the 40% can be bothered to write a review!

Yes mud sticks and it sucks but TA is no different to lots of other "systems" that we have to learn to live with so dare I suggest maybe it's easier to focus on it's positives than dwell on it's negatives?. That's a very low % take up maybe due to relying on forwarding TA hyperlinks? (nicely worded succinct direct email as a follow-up will produce better results for sure).

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When I read a bad review I am much more interested in the response than the review. Is the owner reasonable, points out the facts, sorry that the guest did not enjoy their stay? Or is the owner aggressive, defensive, sarcastic. The latter is very common and these are the properties that I would avoid booking.

Don't get me wrong I'm sensitive and so gutted if I get 4* rather than 5! However I try to address every point and demonstrate how reasonable I am. When you reply to a review the recipient is not the unhappy guest but all your future guests.

£50 compensation. Lol. Totally misguided and that place will now have a 5* gullible ranking on the "dark" net for future rip off artists.

So you could get a poor complaint on TripAdvisor. You could of course not confirm the TA request that the guest stayed and it ain't going to be published. Oh yes social media. When used to "dis" you it is merely a rant forum that shows the failings and ignorance of the writer more often than not.

I'd personally let them rip on TA and use the managers reply (carefully and concisely) to politely show readers what a bunch of shits they are.

Everybody. Do you not think in any case that the value of TA is declining for holiday letting? It is soooooo boring to read countless 5* reviews and Basil Fawlty type grovelling thank you replies from owners. Dull, dull, dull and not a huge help in my decision making process.