I have been reading with interest the last few threads on this section. Whilst I have received 4 bookings and numerous enquiries through the free site self catering breaks over the last couple of years I have yet to receive a single enquiry from the expensive
http://www.holiday-rentals.com/
I signed up with them after reading all the great things on here but it seems in my experience any way they are not great for generating enquiries let alone bookings for my villa in Turkey. Now other Turkey owners might be having more luck but I am a little dismayed that it looks like I have wasted £180 on this listing.
On the other hand I am receiving enquiries from several of the free listing sites so I wonder if certain sites are only popular with surfers for certain areas. I am sure the good publicity on this site will sway a few other owners in the direction of holiday-rentals so thought it important to show they are not great for everyone.
It would be good if under each individual area we are listing under ie France, Spain Turkey etc if anyone who is having particular success with a certain site would post to pass on the tip to other owners. Also if other sites are not doing the business to pass this information on as well. I know there is no such thing as a free lunch but when freebie marketing is beating paid marketing by a mile it leaves a bit of a bitter taste in my mouth.
As there are no stats on holiday rentals I can not even check to see how many people may have viewed my advert. I have also rechecked my advert numerous times so don't think that is the main problem.
As I said I don't wish to be unfair on holiday-rentals so if any other Turkey owners are having great success let us know.
Help ! No Enquiries at all from holiday-rentals.com
Help ! No Enquiries at all from holiday-rentals.com
Last edited by Hanorah on Sun Apr 24, 2005 11:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
Always Learning
Oops Told a Fib did receive one enquiry from someone a bit smarter than me see below
Names Removed
I hope you don't mind us asking what do you think of
the results you have had with turkey-rentals?
We have a property we want to rent out, and we notice
that this site charges a lot - do you think its worth
it.
Names Removed
I hope you don't mind us asking what do you think of
the results you have had with turkey-rentals?
We have a property we want to rent out, and we notice
that this site charges a lot - do you think its worth
it.
Always Learning
Hi Hanorah
Our place is on the Costa Blanca and although initially around two years ago we did well with h-r.com I didn't renew this year as last year only had one booking with them and felt the charge was too high. Having said that I do think some people are very successful but like you I don't think its for me, it has gotton far too big and there are far too many in my area. (by the way do you update your calander every month as this puts you back on top of the list for a while?)
Our place is on the Costa Blanca and although initially around two years ago we did well with h-r.com I didn't renew this year as last year only had one booking with them and felt the charge was too high. Having said that I do think some people are very successful but like you I don't think its for me, it has gotton far too big and there are far too many in my area. (by the way do you update your calander every month as this puts you back on top of the list for a while?)
Hanorah,
I just looked up your property on holiday-rentals.
I haven't forgotten that it is nearly impossible to know which web site will work for a particular property, & holiday-rentals might not be for you, but.......
There are 90+ villas in Turkey to look at, so the small photo next to each property on the listing page has to be good enough to make someone want to click on your property. If you can't interest the public with this photo you might as well give up.
My reaction was this: the grey photo of a stretch of beach with a couple embracing (?) is boring (I thought that beaches in Turkey were stunning? I want to be delighted, surprised, my curiosity awakened - there are too many photos out there to settle for anything less). I can't see anything of the property to rent (ok if the beach was stunning & stunningly DIFFERENT, but it isn't), there are another 90 properties to look at - I'm not going to waste time on yours (sorry, but this is exactly how I reacted ). By the way, on my mac the sand and the water in your photo are both grey (the sky is vaguely blue-grey) - I wouldn't get in a plane to sit on a beach identical to one in England.
Have you always used this photo on the list page??? Have you tried another & had the same results (i.e. no results)?
I'm sorry to be so critical - maybe other members like this photo.......?
I just looked up your property on holiday-rentals.
I haven't forgotten that it is nearly impossible to know which web site will work for a particular property, & holiday-rentals might not be for you, but.......
There are 90+ villas in Turkey to look at, so the small photo next to each property on the listing page has to be good enough to make someone want to click on your property. If you can't interest the public with this photo you might as well give up.
My reaction was this: the grey photo of a stretch of beach with a couple embracing (?) is boring (I thought that beaches in Turkey were stunning? I want to be delighted, surprised, my curiosity awakened - there are too many photos out there to settle for anything less). I can't see anything of the property to rent (ok if the beach was stunning & stunningly DIFFERENT, but it isn't), there are another 90 properties to look at - I'm not going to waste time on yours (sorry, but this is exactly how I reacted ). By the way, on my mac the sand and the water in your photo are both grey (the sky is vaguely blue-grey) - I wouldn't get in a plane to sit on a beach identical to one in England.
Have you always used this photo on the list page??? Have you tried another & had the same results (i.e. no results)?
I'm sorry to be so critical - maybe other members like this photo.......?
Best,
Alexia.
Alexia.
Meishka
I am currently number 1 under the Aegean region. For those that want to look the advert is
http://www.holiday-rentals.com/index.cf ... /19361.cfm
It is useful to know I am not the only one disapointed so thanks very much for replying.
Alexia
The photo was lovely on my website but I do admit something has happened to the quality with the upload process through the site. This was also the case with all others I uploaded. I know manual upload is a new thing so it might have to do with their software and how it is optimising. It is a picture I use on all other sites and many have commented that the crystal clear sea was the thing that caught there attention and most ask is it really like that. The original picture is
http://www.villahanorah.co.uk/images/ph ... on/pages/e)%20Bademli%20Beach%20view%201_jpg.htm
I think that the fact that I use the same picture on all the other sites proves it is not that putting people off unless the visitors to this site are more fussy which is possible. I still wonder if it depends where your holiday home is located though is the key to success or problem in my case. I am at the top of the listings regularly as I do update the calendar and I think it is unusual not to get any enquirires at all. I will however put your theory to the test and try changing photos. Fingers crossed this will do the trick.
Any others who have not been so sucessful with this site?
I am currently number 1 under the Aegean region. For those that want to look the advert is
http://www.holiday-rentals.com/index.cf ... /19361.cfm
It is useful to know I am not the only one disapointed so thanks very much for replying.
Alexia
The photo was lovely on my website but I do admit something has happened to the quality with the upload process through the site. This was also the case with all others I uploaded. I know manual upload is a new thing so it might have to do with their software and how it is optimising. It is a picture I use on all other sites and many have commented that the crystal clear sea was the thing that caught there attention and most ask is it really like that. The original picture is
http://www.villahanorah.co.uk/images/ph ... on/pages/e)%20Bademli%20Beach%20view%201_jpg.htm
I think that the fact that I use the same picture on all the other sites proves it is not that putting people off unless the visitors to this site are more fussy which is possible. I still wonder if it depends where your holiday home is located though is the key to success or problem in my case. I am at the top of the listings regularly as I do update the calendar and I think it is unusual not to get any enquirires at all. I will however put your theory to the test and try changing photos. Fingers crossed this will do the trick.
Any others who have not been so sucessful with this site?
Always Learning
Hanorah - I had a look at your ad - I think you have got your marketing skew whiff - in one breath you are saying it's luxury the next do the £300 rent on a payment plan... either it is luxury and money is no object or it is for folk on a budget - you are giving out mixed signals.
Is the pool in a hotel complex or is it part of your villa?
I personally think you are putting folk off.
Is the pool in a hotel complex or is it part of your villa?
I personally think you are putting folk off.
Hi Tansy I understand what you mean but this is not a problem with any other site other than holiday-rentals, which is my point. Generally on a marketing level I feel I am doing well and am turning down enquiries every day albeit for weeks I am already booked.
Personally I don't think offering our accommodation on a payment plan puts people off. I have two nurses going in 2006 and two guests in October 2005 who loved the idea of paying monthly. They get to forget about it once the standing order is set up and I can be sure that the money is paid in full without cheques bouncing/scams etc. I also nicked the idea from some of the biggest and most successful companies in the world who use this method to sell their luxury goods so it has been globally recognised as a method that works.
The pool is in the hotel but we are right next to them so guests do not have to walk to get there. All guests can also have the privacy of a villa with the convenience of the facilities of a 4 star hotel, which most guests have said is very attractive.
If I am being successful elsewhere, and I am, with exactly the same marketing it is still my belief that holiday rentals are not doing the job for me in particular. Without access to stats it is also impossible to tell as you can on some of the other sites.
I do understand that for some people they are very successful and this has been well documented but the fact remains they are not for me. I have spent time looking at other descriptions on their site for other accommodation and some only have the bare minimum.
If I was having the same response from other sites with almost identical ads I would be more inclined to agree the ad was the problem but the reverse is true.
I am also not trying to put people off using this site but my original question was is it more successful for certain areas or countries than for others. I think this would be very useful for people on this site to know and as in any democracy it is always good to hear the other point of view.
PS I feel all controversial now
Personally I don't think offering our accommodation on a payment plan puts people off. I have two nurses going in 2006 and two guests in October 2005 who loved the idea of paying monthly. They get to forget about it once the standing order is set up and I can be sure that the money is paid in full without cheques bouncing/scams etc. I also nicked the idea from some of the biggest and most successful companies in the world who use this method to sell their luxury goods so it has been globally recognised as a method that works.
The pool is in the hotel but we are right next to them so guests do not have to walk to get there. All guests can also have the privacy of a villa with the convenience of the facilities of a 4 star hotel, which most guests have said is very attractive.
If I am being successful elsewhere, and I am, with exactly the same marketing it is still my belief that holiday rentals are not doing the job for me in particular. Without access to stats it is also impossible to tell as you can on some of the other sites.
I do understand that for some people they are very successful and this has been well documented but the fact remains they are not for me. I have spent time looking at other descriptions on their site for other accommodation and some only have the bare minimum.
If I was having the same response from other sites with almost identical ads I would be more inclined to agree the ad was the problem but the reverse is true.
I am also not trying to put people off using this site but my original question was is it more successful for certain areas or countries than for others. I think this would be very useful for people on this site to know and as in any democracy it is always good to hear the other point of view.
PS I feel all controversial now
Always Learning
Hanorah,
If you are not getting enquiries then either h-r is no good for Turkey (which is possible, but unlikely I would think), or, since the same marketing message works on other sites, people are simply not clicking through to your ad.
You can't do anything about the former, so let's assume people are not clicking through to your ad, even though you are presently the first property in the Turkey section.
Why aren't they clicking?
As Alexia pointed out, your thumbnail pic of the two girls in the sea may not be a strong enough or relevant enough image. It doesn't say to me 'seaside villa in Turkey', which is what I would be looking for. It's a confusing pic in a way because you are not sure what it is saying, so then you read the top line, which is the equivalent of a website's Title on a page of search engine results - if it chimes with what you're looking for you will click it, if it doesn't, you'll read the next one. Your line reads:
"Villa Hanorah Benefitting the local enviroment and people"
I'm going to tell you bluntly - this has to change! First of all it doesn't really mean anything. How can a villa benefit the environment or people? And secondly, people don't care about that, they want to know what's in it for them. This makes it sound like an ad for a charity, not a holiday villa.
That line should hook the reader, hold the eye long enough to encourage a click. It needs to be pithy and it needs to address what the reader is looking for, i.e. a great holiday home and location.
I also think that people will scan the first two words, and that will decide whether they commit to reading the whole line. If you put ‘Villa Hanorah’ at the start of the line, that is a lost opportunity. ‘Villa Hanorah’ doesn’t mean anything to the reader, so it’s a false start to the line, you have to go further to find any meat. Instead of going further, they may well go to the next ad.
Looking at the other advertisers in the Turkey section of holiday-rentals.com, these caught my eye:
'One of the most romantic cottages in the world' [in quotes, which is a neat trick, because you also wonder who said that, and the only way to find out is by clicking]
A very very special house [not actually a very good line but it stands out from the others because it is so different, and I would click to find out why it is so special]
Spacious luxury villa with own pool [the other descriptive lines are all a bit cluttered and this one isn’t so the eye reads it very easily, and it states three key benefits: spacious, luxury and pool]
Ross at h-r.com is an obliging chap, he may be able to tell you if you are getting an unusually low number of visitors to your ad compared to other Turkey ads.
On the ad itself, there are two things I would change. Unfortunately they are rather major things – the text and the photos!
The text reads like a cruise brochure, describing moments of luxury and indolence rather than talking about the villa. This will work better on your own website than here. Here you also need to get the hard facts and benefits out, rather than describing how one might spend the time.
There is only one pic of the villa, and it is not an external shot. The photos you have illustrate unspoilt beaches, a 4-star hotel (where? why?), historic ruins, and the villa’s living room. There is too much focus away from the villa. I think it is fine to use one pic of an outside attraction, but not three. That is saying to me “we would show you the villa itself but we’re worried that might put you off, so here are some other pictures instead�.
In telling you this, I am playing devil’s advocate, trying to find all the possible reasons why you are not getting enquiries from this ad. Sorry if it seems overly critical, it's not meant that way.
If you are not getting enquiries then either h-r is no good for Turkey (which is possible, but unlikely I would think), or, since the same marketing message works on other sites, people are simply not clicking through to your ad.
You can't do anything about the former, so let's assume people are not clicking through to your ad, even though you are presently the first property in the Turkey section.
Why aren't they clicking?
As Alexia pointed out, your thumbnail pic of the two girls in the sea may not be a strong enough or relevant enough image. It doesn't say to me 'seaside villa in Turkey', which is what I would be looking for. It's a confusing pic in a way because you are not sure what it is saying, so then you read the top line, which is the equivalent of a website's Title on a page of search engine results - if it chimes with what you're looking for you will click it, if it doesn't, you'll read the next one. Your line reads:
"Villa Hanorah Benefitting the local enviroment and people"
I'm going to tell you bluntly - this has to change! First of all it doesn't really mean anything. How can a villa benefit the environment or people? And secondly, people don't care about that, they want to know what's in it for them. This makes it sound like an ad for a charity, not a holiday villa.
That line should hook the reader, hold the eye long enough to encourage a click. It needs to be pithy and it needs to address what the reader is looking for, i.e. a great holiday home and location.
I also think that people will scan the first two words, and that will decide whether they commit to reading the whole line. If you put ‘Villa Hanorah’ at the start of the line, that is a lost opportunity. ‘Villa Hanorah’ doesn’t mean anything to the reader, so it’s a false start to the line, you have to go further to find any meat. Instead of going further, they may well go to the next ad.
Looking at the other advertisers in the Turkey section of holiday-rentals.com, these caught my eye:
'One of the most romantic cottages in the world' [in quotes, which is a neat trick, because you also wonder who said that, and the only way to find out is by clicking]
A very very special house [not actually a very good line but it stands out from the others because it is so different, and I would click to find out why it is so special]
Spacious luxury villa with own pool [the other descriptive lines are all a bit cluttered and this one isn’t so the eye reads it very easily, and it states three key benefits: spacious, luxury and pool]
Ross at h-r.com is an obliging chap, he may be able to tell you if you are getting an unusually low number of visitors to your ad compared to other Turkey ads.
On the ad itself, there are two things I would change. Unfortunately they are rather major things – the text and the photos!
The text reads like a cruise brochure, describing moments of luxury and indolence rather than talking about the villa. This will work better on your own website than here. Here you also need to get the hard facts and benefits out, rather than describing how one might spend the time.
There is only one pic of the villa, and it is not an external shot. The photos you have illustrate unspoilt beaches, a 4-star hotel (where? why?), historic ruins, and the villa’s living room. There is too much focus away from the villa. I think it is fine to use one pic of an outside attraction, but not three. That is saying to me “we would show you the villa itself but we’re worried that might put you off, so here are some other pictures instead�.
In telling you this, I am playing devil’s advocate, trying to find all the possible reasons why you are not getting enquiries from this ad. Sorry if it seems overly critical, it's not meant that way.
Paolo
Lay My Hat
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musicmonkey
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Hanorah,
I would write to Holiday-Rentals and ask them for the number of enquiries you should expect to receive. I did this, as I had so few enquiries (having been persuaded by the many people on here raving about their success with HR) and they did reply.
Apparently, properties in my area (Normandy, France) receive on average 2.46 enquiries per month! So no wonder I have had very little response to my listing with them.
I can't say that it has been cost effective for me.
I would write to Holiday-Rentals and ask them for the number of enquiries you should expect to receive. I did this, as I had so few enquiries (having been persuaded by the many people on here raving about their success with HR) and they did reply.
Apparently, properties in my area (Normandy, France) receive on average 2.46 enquiries per month! So no wonder I have had very little response to my listing with them.
I can't say that it has been cost effective for me.
I will take all the points on board and will work on the ad but it does seem that there are others too not having much success which is what I suspected. I will also email to find out how many enquiries I could expect a month as if it is 2 or under then this would explain a lot. I would imagine France is more popular than Turkey so guess that it might even be less.
In fairness I have only been with them for 2 months but then I have only been with several other free sites for the same length of time and have had enquiries. The main point for me is actually getting enquiries as once I can pass them onto my website and converse with them I am able to convert quite a few. I will update you all once I have updated the ad to let you know if my listing becomes more successful but somehow fear that I will not be renewing next year. Lets hope for my bank balance that I will be eating my words and recouping my costs.
Thanks for the replies and the advice everyone, the time you have taken means a lot Sharon
In fairness I have only been with them for 2 months but then I have only been with several other free sites for the same length of time and have had enquiries. The main point for me is actually getting enquiries as once I can pass them onto my website and converse with them I am able to convert quite a few. I will update you all once I have updated the ad to let you know if my listing becomes more successful but somehow fear that I will not be renewing next year. Lets hope for my bank balance that I will be eating my words and recouping my costs.
Thanks for the replies and the advice everyone, the time you have taken means a lot Sharon
Always Learning
Hanorah,
It could certainly be true that Turkish properties just don't do well on H-R.
I agree with all of the above but what I noticed most was that of the four pictures on your ad, only one is of the actual villa. I think a seaside picture is important (and I agree with Alexia that you have other seaside pictures which have deeper blues etc.), but I would also want to see an exterior villa picture and maybe a picture of a luxurious bedroom. When I see a property that only shows pictures of the views I automatically think, "what are they hiding?"
Do the other listing sites you use allow you to link to your website? If they do, that could be a factor in the success of those listings.
Cheers and good luck!
It could certainly be true that Turkish properties just don't do well on H-R.
I agree with all of the above but what I noticed most was that of the four pictures on your ad, only one is of the actual villa. I think a seaside picture is important (and I agree with Alexia that you have other seaside pictures which have deeper blues etc.), but I would also want to see an exterior villa picture and maybe a picture of a luxurious bedroom. When I see a property that only shows pictures of the views I automatically think, "what are they hiding?"
Do the other listing sites you use allow you to link to your website? If they do, that could be a factor in the success of those listings.
Cheers and good luck!
Brooke
Sharon, it´s already been said, but I think your first phrase says it all.........
"Imagine yourself in luxury accommodation"
The truth is it´s unlikely to be yours because no-one knows what it looks like! You can find pictures of kids in the sea and ruins anywhere. Why would you want to pay £180 to show photographs like that to browsers? Prospective enquirers will be onto the next advert in a matter of seconds. Your photograph on the general list of properties in that area is of children in the sea! Personally I wouldn´t click on it, I´d be looking at the next listing. You´re paying the money to show everyone YOUR property. If the property is wonderful, let´s see it!
"Imagine yourself in luxury accommodation"
The truth is it´s unlikely to be yours because no-one knows what it looks like! You can find pictures of kids in the sea and ruins anywhere. Why would you want to pay £180 to show photographs like that to browsers? Prospective enquirers will be onto the next advert in a matter of seconds. Your photograph on the general list of properties in that area is of children in the sea! Personally I wouldn´t click on it, I´d be looking at the next listing. You´re paying the money to show everyone YOUR property. If the property is wonderful, let´s see it!
Hanorah, like Oskar has said, "it's your property people want to see" and I think that's the best advice you can get.
Someone who has decided on going to Turkey will not have made up his mind by booking in your property. It will all boil down to where the prospective client decides to stay, and that's where you come in. I cannot give you technical advice, as I'm no expert, though being a client of Holiday-Rentals, I have had very good response from their site, approx. 60% of all enqieries, which in real terms turned out to be 22 weeks confirmed bookings.
True is the fact that there are only 20 listings for Malta & Gozo, but then again, the market in Malta is also much smaller.
One other thing I noticed from what you wrote is that you have been listed for only 2 months - this too may be a bit late to catch the early bookers. I have learnt from experience that the potential clients from the UK have the tendancy to book very early, sometimes as far as 12 months in advance. I get the most "summer bookings/enquieries" in November, December and January. If you were not listed then you may have missed the "window of opportunity" as I like to call it.
Someone who has decided on going to Turkey will not have made up his mind by booking in your property. It will all boil down to where the prospective client decides to stay, and that's where you come in. I cannot give you technical advice, as I'm no expert, though being a client of Holiday-Rentals, I have had very good response from their site, approx. 60% of all enqieries, which in real terms turned out to be 22 weeks confirmed bookings.
True is the fact that there are only 20 listings for Malta & Gozo, but then again, the market in Malta is also much smaller.
One other thing I noticed from what you wrote is that you have been listed for only 2 months - this too may be a bit late to catch the early bookers. I have learnt from experience that the potential clients from the UK have the tendancy to book very early, sometimes as far as 12 months in advance. I get the most "summer bookings/enquieries" in November, December and January. If you were not listed then you may have missed the "window of opportunity" as I like to call it.
Malta – always in the sunshine!
I have updated my ad but I think they need to aprove it before all changes are showing. Unfortunately there is a charge of £10 to change photos so will definetly not be doing this unless I receive some enquiries. I have changed the thumbnail to the internal shot though so hope this helps.
I was at work today and my husband says Ross called so he must have seen this thread. He asked him to call back on Wednesday when I am off. I feel a bit embarrassed now hope he doesn't tell me off.
Once again thanks for all the great advice I will buy you all a beer if it works out.
I was at work today and my husband says Ross called so he must have seen this thread. He asked him to call back on Wednesday when I am off. I feel a bit embarrassed now hope he doesn't tell me off.
Once again thanks for all the great advice I will buy you all a beer if it works out.
Always Learning