Our refurbishment has gone well and we spent Christmas and New Year in the flat .....sort of a snagging holiday!
Anyway we are puzzling over what to do about the settings for the heating. The house is all electric and has an electric boiler wet central heating system. We now have Economy 10 meter installed which gives us cheap rates three time a day...cheap rate timing as follows:
04:30 – 07:30
13:30 – 16:30
20:30 – 00:30
Over Christmas I just set the timing of the boiler thermostat to roughly match those of the off-peak rate. Was thinking about how we should set this up for guests. The boiler thermostat has 6 heating events that you can program for you to set room temperature...in effect the boiler is not switched off ....just that the temperature setting can be switched low! Guest can override the set temperature just by increasing the room thermostat. My thinking was :
06:30 - 07:30 21deg.C (takes chill of the rooms)
07:30 - 20:30 15deg.C (effectively turns heating off)
20:30 - 23:30 21deg.C
23:30 - 02:30 15deg.C
02:30 - 04:30 15deg.C (used as temp reset in case guest dial up heating before going to bed)
Clearly we want guests comfortable and they would be free to manually dial up the temperature anytime they want but we want to try and ensure the automatic settings would prevent heating being left on while guest are out during the day or go to bed as much as possible.
Any opinions?
Another Heating Question
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Joanna
- Posts: 1091
- Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2007 3:12 pm
- Location: Chester, North West England & Sidmouth, East Devon
- Contact:
730 seems way too early to turn the heating down in a holiday let. Guests won't want to have to get out of bed to turn it up - I'd be inclined to let it stay higher for another 2-3 hours at least.
I'd also set the daytime temp higher - maybe around 18/19? Then if guests come and go during the day it's always welcoming.
The evening temperature I would set to coincide with sunset when the temperature outside drops. So in winter that could be around 3 or 4 pm in your area.
It may seem extravagant but I'm guessing that in the coldest months you'll have the most empty periods when the heating will barely be on at all. We had guests from Thailand in over Christmas and they had the heating cranked up 24 hours a day (our climate must have been a bit of a shock for them!). It's not a problem at all since the house is empty for most of January and the heating's just ticking over on 'frost' setting so it will all average out.
I'd also set the daytime temp higher - maybe around 18/19? Then if guests come and go during the day it's always welcoming.
The evening temperature I would set to coincide with sunset when the temperature outside drops. So in winter that could be around 3 or 4 pm in your area.
It may seem extravagant but I'm guessing that in the coldest months you'll have the most empty periods when the heating will barely be on at all. We had guests from Thailand in over Christmas and they had the heating cranked up 24 hours a day (our climate must have been a bit of a shock for them!). It's not a problem at all since the house is empty for most of January and the heating's just ticking over on 'frost' setting so it will all average out.
Jo
Joint owner of Baker's Cottage in Chester & Chandler's Cottage in Sidmouth
Joint owner of Baker's Cottage in Chester & Chandler's Cottage in Sidmouth
Whilst I appreciate what you are trying to do, your proposals would be totally inadequate for me. On holiday I do not get up until about 8.30-9.00am. The heating by then will have been off for over an hour, having only been on for 1 hour at a low 21 degrees. Brrr!
Your timings are counter productive for what you want to achieve IMO. I would just turn it up when I got up and it would end up staying on all day! Whereas, if it just knocked back slightly mid-late morning then there is less likelihood of it being turned up once guests have gone out (assuming they do). If I don't turn it up, and I go out for the day, when I come back late afternoon the house is going to be freezing. Yes, I can manually over ride it, and I would, because I don't want to return to a cold house and have to sit in my coat waiting for it to warm up.
If I don't turn it up, 8.30pm seems a very late time for the heating to come on for the evening.
As much as I hate waste, I do like to be warm and I think your current settings will quickly generate complaints.
Post crossed with Joanna!
Your timings are counter productive for what you want to achieve IMO. I would just turn it up when I got up and it would end up staying on all day! Whereas, if it just knocked back slightly mid-late morning then there is less likelihood of it being turned up once guests have gone out (assuming they do). If I don't turn it up, and I go out for the day, when I come back late afternoon the house is going to be freezing. Yes, I can manually over ride it, and I would, because I don't want to return to a cold house and have to sit in my coat waiting for it to warm up.
If I don't turn it up, 8.30pm seems a very late time for the heating to come on for the evening.
As much as I hate waste, I do like to be warm and I think your current settings will quickly generate complaints.
Post crossed with Joanna!
I don't imagine guests will be remotely happy with 15C at any time. It's also below the bottom of the typical range of 16C to 19C suggested for sleep for the "average person", and many guests will want it higher than that.
Your best way forward is to envisage what holidaying guests will want and expect, then work out how to provide that. Joanna's suggestion of a minimum daytime of 18-19 seems reasonable as long as the place will warm up quickly if guests are in. An evening temperature of 21 is probably not going to find favour with a lot of guests as a temperature in which to sit around and relax - again as Joanna says, from dusk onwards.
Your best way forward is to envisage what holidaying guests will want and expect, then work out how to provide that. Joanna's suggestion of a minimum daytime of 18-19 seems reasonable as long as the place will warm up quickly if guests are in. An evening temperature of 21 is probably not going to find favour with a lot of guests as a temperature in which to sit around and relax - again as Joanna says, from dusk onwards.
Re: Another Heating Question
Is the actually going to be work out cheaper? These times may be suitable for someone who is prepared to alter their lifestyle to use electric during these times; but you can't expect holidaymakers to do this. They may well want to use lots of electric outside these periods. As I understand it, you pay more for electric used outside these times than you would on a standard tariff.Gary2604 wrote:Our refurbishment has gone well and we spent Christmas and New Year in the flat .....sort of a snagging holiday!
Anyway we are puzzling over what to do about the settings for the heating. The house is all electric and has an electric boiler wet central heating system. We now have Economy 10 meter installed which gives us cheap rates three time a day...cheap rate timing as follows:
04:30 – 07:30
13:30 – 16:30
20:30 – 00:30
I don't know if I am misunderstanding things here.
Are you saying that if the guests are in residence and have turned up the thermostat that they have in fact overridden your programme, so if they have put the thermostat on say 21* when they go to bed, then that (21*) would be the room temperature if they got up at 9.30 am? Or would it be 15* ??
Are you saying that if the guests are in residence and have turned up the thermostat that they have in fact overridden your programme, so if they have put the thermostat on say 21* when they go to bed, then that (21*) would be the room temperature if they got up at 9.30 am? Or would it be 15* ??
My understanding is that even if the guests turn it up, it will only remain on that setting until the next scheduled program kicks in and automatically alters it again. Hence I believe guests would get up to 15 degrees if they get up before 7.30 or considerably after. It seems they only have a 1 hour window to get up if they want to be warm (ish). Please correct me if I'm wrong Gary?
Thanks for all the replies and you make some good points.
Bunny - yes you've got that exactly right.
With the type of heating we have economy 10 is the only option, anything else would be too expensive.
Over Christmas and new year we had 7 people staying, were only planning for 6 guests max. Only one person mentioned they found it cold in the morning when we got up around 9:00am...the house is quite well insulated now so retains heat reasonably well.
The 15deg.c setting is really in effect turning the heating off....I don't think the house really gets to that temperature except perhaps over night. It certainly is too cold be to sitting around watching TV but fine when your moving around and getting ready to go out.
I think from the suggestions I would revise the morning temperatures to run through to 8:30 then have another temperature 'event' mid morning that would reset the temperatures should they have been left turned up.
At the end of the day it will never suit everyone and will depend if guest spend more time indoors than outside. As has been mentioned we would clearly have few guest in winter so we are perhaps being a bit conservative......or mean.....with the settings! We do have a wood burner as well so hopefully that will help keep the utility bills down.
Bunny - yes you've got that exactly right.
With the type of heating we have economy 10 is the only option, anything else would be too expensive.
Over Christmas and new year we had 7 people staying, were only planning for 6 guests max. Only one person mentioned they found it cold in the morning when we got up around 9:00am...the house is quite well insulated now so retains heat reasonably well.
The 15deg.c setting is really in effect turning the heating off....I don't think the house really gets to that temperature except perhaps over night. It certainly is too cold be to sitting around watching TV but fine when your moving around and getting ready to go out.
I think from the suggestions I would revise the morning temperatures to run through to 8:30 then have another temperature 'event' mid morning that would reset the temperatures should they have been left turned up.
At the end of the day it will never suit everyone and will depend if guest spend more time indoors than outside. As has been mentioned we would clearly have few guest in winter so we are perhaps being a bit conservative......or mean.....with the settings! We do have a wood burner as well so hopefully that will help keep the utility bills down.
I have all electric heating. It comes on at 6 and goes off at 10. It comes on for an hour between 1 and 2. It is off again until 4.30 and then stays on until 11. It can be manually overridden at any time and if the guest chose to have it on 24/7 they could. They are small properties, one is better insulated than the other.
I'm not even out of bed before 7.30; I'm on holiday relaxing, and I don't go to bed until after 11. We all have very different lifestyles when on holiday, some will rise early and go to bed early, some the opposite; some will spend time in the property relaxing, others go out exploring for the day. I get every kind of holiday maker at mine, so I can't predict exactly what their needs are. My scenario covers pretty much them all. My bills are not astronomic, as the heat is only lost quickly when doors or windows are opened, and only a gradual cooling when not on at all, but I never have cold or complaining guests. That, for me is the number one priority, not my electric bill, but happy guests that will recommend me and return.
For every guest that mentions the cold there could well be 10 that don't complain, but it simply spoils their holiday and they won't return. If you can build that cost into your rental rates from the outset, both you and the guests will be a lot happier and stress free.
PS 15 is waaaay to cold for us southerners. We don't live with freezing temperatures and snow, our blood is warm and we want it to stay that way.
Not even when moving around the house is 15 warm enough. I only have it that low, when the property is empty with no guest bookings for a while.
I'm not even out of bed before 7.30; I'm on holiday relaxing, and I don't go to bed until after 11. We all have very different lifestyles when on holiday, some will rise early and go to bed early, some the opposite; some will spend time in the property relaxing, others go out exploring for the day. I get every kind of holiday maker at mine, so I can't predict exactly what their needs are. My scenario covers pretty much them all. My bills are not astronomic, as the heat is only lost quickly when doors or windows are opened, and only a gradual cooling when not on at all, but I never have cold or complaining guests. That, for me is the number one priority, not my electric bill, but happy guests that will recommend me and return.
For every guest that mentions the cold there could well be 10 that don't complain, but it simply spoils their holiday and they won't return. If you can build that cost into your rental rates from the outset, both you and the guests will be a lot happier and stress free.
PS 15 is waaaay to cold for us southerners. We don't live with freezing temperatures and snow, our blood is warm and we want it to stay that way.
Not even when moving around the house is 15 warm enough. I only have it that low, when the property is empty with no guest bookings for a while.Exactly on the nail Nemo!
(Some of us northerners need to be warm as well!)
I would be irritated at constantly having to go and fiddle with the thermostat if the hearing kept going off during the day.
What would you do if you booked into a good hotel only to find that the heating kept getting switched off???
(Some of us northerners need to be warm as well!)
I would be irritated at constantly having to go and fiddle with the thermostat if the hearing kept going off during the day.
What would you do if you booked into a good hotel only to find that the heating kept getting switched off???
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RichardHenshall
- Posts: 414
- Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2009 4:06 pm
- Location: Luz, Algarve
Does your electric boiler supply heat to a thermal store (from which the radiators are heated) or directly to the radiators (such as with a combi-boiler)?Gary2604 wrote:... With the type of heating we have economy 10 is the only option, anything else would be too expensive. ...
If the former you can have a disconnect between the (off-peak) times when the thermal store is heated and when the house is heated, so everybody is happy.
Nemo, Zebedee, Richard,
Thanks for the input!
Nemo - I think your timings, as you say, would cover the broadest range of your guests. I guess we are just trying to find the right balance! Indeed the most important thing is happy guests so that must take priority over trying to keep the bills down. Don't get to hungup on the 15deg.c figure.....it's not really the temperature of the house ....really just an off setting.
Zebedee - difficult to compare a hotel room with a holiday let.....I don't think it is sensible to have heating on 24/7, there needs to be some input from guests to regulate heating so some degree of fiddling will always be required....but accept the point your making.
Richard - I'm afraid there is no heat store.....the heating works just like a combi boiler.
Thanks for the input!
Nemo - I think your timings, as you say, would cover the broadest range of your guests. I guess we are just trying to find the right balance! Indeed the most important thing is happy guests so that must take priority over trying to keep the bills down. Don't get to hungup on the 15deg.c figure.....it's not really the temperature of the house ....really just an off setting.
Zebedee - difficult to compare a hotel room with a holiday let.....I don't think it is sensible to have heating on 24/7, there needs to be some input from guests to regulate heating so some degree of fiddling will always be required....but accept the point your making.
Richard - I'm afraid there is no heat store.....the heating works just like a combi boiler.
We stayed in a let in Ireland once where they tried to be very cheap w the heating...and if was feb and freezing (!) we turned it up but every hour it would click back to the unreasonably cold setting...so we pooched through their garage and found their personal stash of space heaters and ran them nonstop throughout our stay. I'm assuming the electric bill was high but it was not reasonable for us to freeze.
We've found that, providing lots of super-warm duvets helps with consumption as well as *removing* them from the beds in summer (!) we were finding people turned up the ac at night and slept under warm duvets (!)
We've found that, providing lots of super-warm duvets helps with consumption
as well as *removing* them from the beds in summer (!) we were finding people turned up the ac at night and slept under warm duvets (!)We have oil central heating ( we went for this when renovating ) when we first had the oil central heating fitted we had a digital thermostat timer. But our first few guests could not work it, and I was called out a few times ( this was last September when temp dropped uk ) We then had our oil engineer change it to a bog standard temp control, where the guests control the heating. Radiators are also controlled and set at 3. Also we have log burner ( logs included ). Yes some guests use more oil but then others little, but then that depends on who likes baths/showers also on how cold the weather.
Run Wild Run Free
Mine is set to 22c from 7.30 to 10am
10.00-16.00 its 17c
16.00-23.00 to 22c
23.00-7.30 16c
The guests can over ride at any time but only until the next timed change when it reverts to my programming. So if they come in at lunchtime for example they can put the heating up to whatever they like. At 4pm it will revert to 22c
10.00-16.00 its 17c
16.00-23.00 to 22c
23.00-7.30 16c
The guests can over ride at any time but only until the next timed change when it reverts to my programming. So if they come in at lunchtime for example they can put the heating up to whatever they like. At 4pm it will revert to 22c