To install Pool heating or not?

[bornintheuk]

Bassman, I think the important phrase is "properly designed".
Yes, heat pumps have come down in price (Chinese imports mainly) and can work successfully. They still cost money to run, whereas solar is free.
For information our "properly designed" solar heating system for our pool has maintained 28C from April to now, and that is only limited by the setting on the control box. Our in-ground hot tub has been at 40C, also solar heated.
In the end its a personal choice but to say solar heating does not work for pool heating is plain wrong. Thousands of installations around the world show that it is a successful implementation of solar energy capture.

[la vache!]

In the end its a personal choice but to say solar heating does not work for pool heating is plain wrong.

Maybe they are in warmer climates than France?
I'm only going on what guests have told me, and other gite owners who live further south than me but found that solar heating was a waste of time. I have a PSA heat pump, 5k euros 12 years ago but it is still going strong and the temperature is 28°C from mid April onwards.

[bornintheuk]

other gite owners who live further south than me but found that solar heating was a waste of time.

Well here is a gite owner who says it works well

[Fraise]

other gite owners who live further south than me but found that solar heating was a waste of time.

Well here is a gite owner who says it works well

...... but solar heating IS your business isn't it?

[la vache!]

other gite owners who live further south than me but found that solar heating was a waste of time.

Well here is a gite owner who says it works well

...... but solar heating IS your business isn't it?

Yes, funny that, isn't it????

[Bassman]

As i have said in previous posts i think a combination of the 2 systems would work well but personally i wouldn’t consider just solar.

[bornintheuk]

Well here is a gite owner who says it works well

...... but solar heating IS your business isn't it?

Yes, funny that, isn't it????

Not very funny LV.
I installed the heating system on my pool and run it for 2 seasons to ensure that it worked (back in 1999 and 2000) - I am an engineer by training and don't rely on heresay and anecdotal evidence to make my decisions.
It was after this period of trial and test that I contacted the manufacturer in the USA and he and I entered a business arrangement to supply the systems in to the French market.
So there you have it - fact not fiction. And the same system is running still with no additional costs.
You can choose to believe that or not, but I know solar heating for pools works - point finale! ( Or of course you can call me a liar )

[Bassman]

Bornintheuk wrote
( Or of course you can call me a liar )

Who would be that brave bornintheuk

[RichardHenshall]

... I have a PSA heat pump, 5k euros 12 years ago but it is still going strong and the temperature is 28°C from mid April onwards.

Can you estimate your annual electricity consumption/cost for pool heating? Do you cover the pool when not in use, or just at night?

[wallypott]

But would solar really work without any sunshine? We had no sun until August this year - really none. And while others were complaining of drought we had months of rain.

[Hells Bells]

Perhaps not really a fair comparison, but I installed some solar lighting in our garden in Spring. Despite weeks of rain,and almost no sun, the lights shone every night. Neighbours have solar panels, and they still generated enough power for their own house, and sent some back to the grid, I think they were about £300 in profit.

[CarolineH]

Perhaps not really a fair comparison, but I installed some solar lighting in our garden in Spring. Despite weeks of rain,and almost no sun, the lights shone every night. Neighbours have solar panels, and they still generated enough power for their own house, and sent some back to the grid, I think they were about £300 in profit.

As far as I understand it there are two types of solar - the solar lighting and solar panels that you are talking about, Helen are photovoltaic. This is the most efficient way of converting the suns rays or light into energy.

Swimming pool heating is on a much cheaper system of simply passing the pool water through black piping on a flat surface that is facing the sun - hence sun rays are necessary rather than just light. It also depends on the surface area of the solar heating pipes.

My experience of solar heated pools in Brittany is that they are fine in the hotter months of July and August (caveat here for unseasonal weather!!) but cannot be relied upon solely to heat a pool for the shoulder season. In my case, pool heating in shoulder season is much more important because it is at this time that I get smaller children, who require warm water for swimming.

I have stayed in a cottage in Brittany during the last week of May and first week of June when my kids were 2 and 4 - the owners advertised a heated pool and the water was only 17°C because it was solar heating - not warm enough for us to swim and during that holiday I vowed that I would never install a solar heated pool, hence my heat pump which maintains 28°C from the beginning of April until the end of October.

[bornintheuk]

My experience of solar heated pools in Brittany is that they are fine in the hotter months of July and August (caveat here for unseasonal weather!!) but cannot be relied upon solely to heat a pool for the shoulder season.

This is probably true for areas like Brittany which lack sunshine hours. South of the Loire where my experience is based then there is not an issue with solar heating. I would hasard a guess that also in Brittany in order to maintain a comfortable temperature in the shoulder months even with heat pumps, you would need an abri, as the heat loss overnight would have to be replaced by a heat pump. A kWh of energy will heat approx 860 litres of water 1 deg C, so to replace 2 deg C loss overnight (not unreasonable with just a bubble cover) in a 10x5x1.5m pool would require the heat pump to add 170 kWh to replace that loss. Even at an efficiency of x4 that is 43 kWh input power. Not cheap !
( Apologies for techy stuff, an engineer )
But then if its sunny as well during the day then you can add the power of the sun for free !

[Bassman]

bornintheuk wrote
A kWh of energy will heat approx 860 litres of water 1 deg C, so to replace 2 deg C loss overnight (not unreasonable with just a bubble cover) in a 10x5x1.5m pool would require the heat pump to add 170 kWh to replace that loss. Even at an efficiency of x4 that is 43 kWh input power. Not cheap !
But then if its sunny .......

We are based in Charente maritime & don’t have an abri just a bubble cover that needs replacing!
Your calculations are pretty much spot on bornintheuk and as we pay roughly 0.06€/kwh (edf tempo) & to keep our 55m3 pool at 28°C morning to night it costs around 2.50€ per day this will probably double in cost for the last 2 weeks of September to around 5€ per day, 1.25€ per gite.
The reason I use a heat pump & not solar is my guest can use the pool from morning to evening and there is no if the sun shines.

[la vache!]

Yep, I'd agree with the calculations too. My pool is 80m3 so is even more expensive to run. The abri cover helps enormously conserve the temperature as the heat doesn't part so much at night. Without the abri the pool would be no more than 21°C at the end of September, and probably not warm enough to use from mid September onwards. With the abri it is 28°C April - November (as long as there aren't too many frosts!). But my electric bills are still pretty high.