Someone has expressed an interest in booking our house in the Tarn in France for four months over the Winter. We are used to one and two week bookings. I would welcome any advice on:
- a good rental agreement
- any pitfalls in French Law with long term renting
- pricing v weekly advertised
- paying for utilities (should they be extra)?
- reconnecting and billling phone
- How much upfront
- any other advice
Thanks
Eugene
Winter Letting/Long Term Rental
Winter Letting/Long Term Rental
New owners of converted barn. New to French Property scene....help!
I did a two month let last winter. Next time around, I would absolutely charge separated for utilities or, rather, I would charge for usage above a certain amount. If not, don't be surprised to see the windows wide open on sunny (but cold) days... while the furnace runs full blast. A great way to air the house out each morning!!!
I also recommend you get each payment far enough in advance that you are not left with an empty rental, should they suddenly decide to move on. (Maybe divide into four payments? First month taken as booking deposit, second month is due 60 days before arrival, third month due upon arrival, fourth month due at beginning of second month?)
We doubled our standard damage deposit and I was very glad I did so, even though we returned it in full.
We have a "no-party, no disturbing the neighbors" clause in our standard agreement (eg, max number of people on the property can not exceed the max occupancy unless we give prior approval in writing) and if you don't have one in your standard agreement, I'd recommend the same for peace of mind. Our guests had one dinner party and all was fine. Neighbors had no complaints.
Also, plan for a week, minimum, to put the property back together before the next guests arrive. Our guests were quite clean and tidy but long-term usage is still very different than short-term. Most everything will need to be THOROUGHLY tweaked and polished to get back in tip-top shape.
Someone familiar with French law will be able to help sort out whether or not you are creating special liabilities for yourself in this type of situation...
Hope it works out well!
debk
I also recommend you get each payment far enough in advance that you are not left with an empty rental, should they suddenly decide to move on. (Maybe divide into four payments? First month taken as booking deposit, second month is due 60 days before arrival, third month due upon arrival, fourth month due at beginning of second month?)
We doubled our standard damage deposit and I was very glad I did so, even though we returned it in full.
We have a "no-party, no disturbing the neighbors" clause in our standard agreement (eg, max number of people on the property can not exceed the max occupancy unless we give prior approval in writing) and if you don't have one in your standard agreement, I'd recommend the same for peace of mind. Our guests had one dinner party and all was fine. Neighbors had no complaints.
Also, plan for a week, minimum, to put the property back together before the next guests arrive. Our guests were quite clean and tidy but long-term usage is still very different than short-term. Most everything will need to be THOROUGHLY tweaked and polished to get back in tip-top shape.
Someone familiar with French law will be able to help sort out whether or not you are creating special liabilities for yourself in this type of situation...
Hope it works out well!
debk
I've done two long term rentals and both have been a lot of trouble 
...........both sets of tenants have left the house in a bad state and both have changed their plans leaving me in the lurch...I documented the last sorry tale here recently. Having said that maybe I've been unlucky and also I probably haven't handled the possible issues properly from the start.
I agree with everything debk says with regard to monies upfront. That way you won't lose time if they do change their plans...If I was to do it again I think I'd also now want to agree a final cleaning charge which I would take at the beginning of the rental...When people are living somewhere long term there is so much more wear and tear than when they just come and go...I'd also factor in that you may need to repaint after a long let and absolutely everything in the property will need to be cleaned and washed before you could have other guests as in curtains and such like...
I probably will look for a long let for this winter but I'll try to keep my clever head on!
...........both sets of tenants have left the house in a bad state and both have changed their plans leaving me in the lurch...I documented the last sorry tale here recently. Having said that maybe I've been unlucky and also I probably haven't handled the possible issues properly from the start.I agree with everything debk says with regard to monies upfront. That way you won't lose time if they do change their plans...If I was to do it again I think I'd also now want to agree a final cleaning charge which I would take at the beginning of the rental...When people are living somewhere long term there is so much more wear and tear than when they just come and go...I'd also factor in that you may need to repaint after a long let and absolutely everything in the property will need to be cleaned and washed before you could have other guests as in curtains and such like...
I probably will look for a long let for this winter but I'll try to keep my clever head on!
We haven't yet done a long let - and hope we won't have too, but to support Garlic's comments- we lived in one of our gites this winter whilst work was done on our house and it took ages to get ready for the season. There is all the problem about heating costs to think of and then when it's raining the gite gets so much more dirty - we had an old towel ( yes one of those stained ones!!) by the door but mud still seemed to get in.
If I were to do it I'd really like to think it through. perhaps we should come up with a definitive guide to long lets like the equipment list we designed
If I were to do it I'd really like to think it through. perhaps we should come up with a definitive guide to long lets like the equipment list we designed
I personally wouldn't take a long let, unless I actually knew the people involved.
I don't think the money you get is worth the risk.
The wear and tear on the property would be high, there would be no chance of doing the usual maintenance jobs that get done in the closed season.
You have no guarentee that they will vacate the property at the right time. You can have all the pieces of paper in the world, but if they don't want to go then eviction proceedures take time.
Just my thoughts of course.
Ju
I don't think the money you get is worth the risk.
The wear and tear on the property would be high, there would be no chance of doing the usual maintenance jobs that get done in the closed season.
You have no guarentee that they will vacate the property at the right time. You can have all the pieces of paper in the world, but if they don't want to go then eviction proceedures take time.
Just my thoughts of course.
Ju
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CostaBlanca
- Posts: 253
- Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2006 2:58 pm
- Location: Costa Blanca
Hi,
I have taken a number of long Winter lets in my apartment usually to pensioners who are coming out here for some Winter sun. I take at least a month´s rental as a deposit and then 3 months up front. I have also taken a number of bookings on recommendation from people we know.
I too would be wary of any booking more than a month or so to people that I knew nothing about. Spain must be similar to France - it would take at least a year for the courts to get unwanted tenants out. In the meantime, they stay in your apartment free of charge. Usually, before the court´s order to vacate is finalised, they disappear in the middle of the night leaving a lot of damage.
Check out your clients well before deciding to go ahead.
Suerte,
I have taken a number of long Winter lets in my apartment usually to pensioners who are coming out here for some Winter sun. I take at least a month´s rental as a deposit and then 3 months up front. I have also taken a number of bookings on recommendation from people we know.
I too would be wary of any booking more than a month or so to people that I knew nothing about. Spain must be similar to France - it would take at least a year for the courts to get unwanted tenants out. In the meantime, they stay in your apartment free of charge. Usually, before the court´s order to vacate is finalised, they disappear in the middle of the night leaving a lot of damage.
Check out your clients well before deciding to go ahead.
Suerte,
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Alan Knighting
- Posts: 4120
- Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 7:26 am
- Location: Monflanquin, Lot-et-Garonne, France
Of course hypothetically one can come up with all sorts of horror scenarios when considering longer term lettings but it doesn’t have to be that way.
Towards the end of last year we had a sprinkling of holiday lettings booked for the 2006 season. We then received two enquiries for longer term lets; one for April-August, the other for April-December. We pointed out that they would have to move in and out to make way for our holiday lettings and both parties agreed and have done so. On each occasion the properties were left in the same state as they would have been if they had been occupied by holiday makers, i.e. in a good state.
All service costs are the responsibility of the tenants so we don’t mind how much electricity, water, gas or wood they use – they pay for it. We have also found the day-to-day maintenance jobs like changing light bulbs and replacing broken glasses the tenants have done as a matter of course.
The first people were regular visitors who had decided to find and buy a house in the immediate vicinity. Over the years we have come to know them very well, to trust them as friends and our trust has not been misplaced.
The second people are living in the area for at least 12 months before deciding whether or not to buy. They had already lived in the area for 3 months before moving into our property so we were able to meet them and to speak to their previous landlord before going ahead. So far, our trust in them has not been misplaced.
Living on-site and socialising with our tenants has given us the advantage of being able to closely monitor our properties and how they are being treated.
We are not blind to the potential problems but our experience thus far has been quite reassuring. Suffice it to say that we are open-minded towards longer lettings of up to but not including one year. Lettings of a year of more give tenants statutory occupational rights which we are not prepared to accept.
Alan
Towards the end of last year we had a sprinkling of holiday lettings booked for the 2006 season. We then received two enquiries for longer term lets; one for April-August, the other for April-December. We pointed out that they would have to move in and out to make way for our holiday lettings and both parties agreed and have done so. On each occasion the properties were left in the same state as they would have been if they had been occupied by holiday makers, i.e. in a good state.
All service costs are the responsibility of the tenants so we don’t mind how much electricity, water, gas or wood they use – they pay for it. We have also found the day-to-day maintenance jobs like changing light bulbs and replacing broken glasses the tenants have done as a matter of course.
The first people were regular visitors who had decided to find and buy a house in the immediate vicinity. Over the years we have come to know them very well, to trust them as friends and our trust has not been misplaced.
The second people are living in the area for at least 12 months before deciding whether or not to buy. They had already lived in the area for 3 months before moving into our property so we were able to meet them and to speak to their previous landlord before going ahead. So far, our trust in them has not been misplaced.
Living on-site and socialising with our tenants has given us the advantage of being able to closely monitor our properties and how they are being treated.
We are not blind to the potential problems but our experience thus far has been quite reassuring. Suffice it to say that we are open-minded towards longer lettings of up to but not including one year. Lettings of a year of more give tenants statutory occupational rights which we are not prepared to accept.
Alan
Long Term (Winter) Let
Thanks to all for advice provided. I will let you know my experience (good or bad).
Eugene Leddy
Eugene Leddy
New owners of converted barn. New to French Property scene....help!