Electric shocks

[Giddy Goat]

I am posting here as we're still reeling in shock at the size of our recent electricity bill. This was based on a reading provided by our caretakers, whereas all the others have been estimated, apart from the first proper one after we moved in, which was also a reading. Clearly, the estimated ones were hugely optimistic and we've been basking in a sense of false security all these months!

Because the house is occupied less than 6 months of the year, we were advised when we signed up 14 months ago approx that the Tarif Bleu would be more economical, and I am wondering if some of you could tell me what your annual electricity consumption (in euros) totals on average, if you have the figures to hand please? Those who are in a similar situation to us, and those who live permanently in France. It would be really useful to compare.

The house is fairly large, 4 bedrooms, 4 bathrooms, and was either let or used by us for a total of around 21 weeks, including perhaps a max of just 4 weeks when the heating (electric radiators, unfortunately) would have been in use. The electric heating is supplemented by 2 woodburning stoves, which are very efficient and I dread to think what the bills would have been like without them, as our consumption for the last 12 months totalled a fur-raising €2,710 inc TVA. I can't believe this is normal!

[Guest3]

Hi Jane

Your posting made me tot up our electric bills for the villa (which is 4 bed 3 bath, pool and garden lighting) for the year (Jul 2006 to Jul 2007) and our annual usage was 1689 euros including IVA..which was suprising as I thought it would be more than that.

I don't know if the electricity charges are more in France than in Spain, but I think your bill is high considering your house is only occupied for 6 months of the year.

PS What I forgot to add is that the whole property is electric apart from a wood burning furnace that is only used in Winter (mainly for effect rather than heat).

[enid]

Our last bill was just over 2000 euros but we did live in a gite all winter and that heated the wayer and the bedrooms with electricity - we could counter that as our fuel bill was much reduced as we didn't use the oil fired central heating in the house.

Our normal bill with our permanent residence plus 2 gites rented at 24 weeks between them comes to usually 97 euros per month.

I would query your bill.

[Fraise]

I pay a standing order of 137 euros a month for my private home, less for the gite. I think the gite is about half of this.This figure is based on when I lived here much more than I do now, so I am hoping for a rebate, or at least a reduction for next year !!

Just realised, you need a bit more info- this is for a fairly large house with 6 bedrooms, 4 baths, pool,3 dehumidifiers on 24/7, 2 sep water heaters, electric ovens,all the usual stuff. The other house is 3 bedrooms, 2 baths, pool plus all the normal electrical stuff ( electric oven and water heater ). I have Tempo for my house,the same as you for the gite.

www.thepetitmanoir.com

[Ju]

Jane, Do you have a pool? Is it heated using electric? This will make a huge difference to your bills.

For 2005 we payed 650 Euros for the big gite (five bedrooms) plus pool (but not heating). We are on tempo, cook on gas and have oil heating.

Are you sure of your starting meter reading?

Ju

[la vache!]

Ju, is that 650€ for the electricity incl. standing charges and TVA? If so, that is really good.
Jane, your bill sounds very expensive. As another comparison, mine was about 1300€ for a 6 bed farmhouse (wood heating) and a 2 bed gite (electric heating) + pool (including heat pump), on the tarif tempo.
If you don't use your house much in the winter (from 31st Oct -1st March) and can live without electric radiators if you are there then, I would have thought the tempo would be a better option. I have the tarif bleu in my own house, but there are only 2 of us most of the time, the standing charge is really low and I have gas heating (unfortunately) so it works out OK for me.

[Giddy Goat]

Thank you all for your responses, it was very kind of you - though now I'm feeling really glum. We do need the radiators on in the winter Susan, so no savings to be made there. The main problem may lie with the water heaters - we have three - because the house is L-shaped, I guess the architects thought this was the most economical solution, and it means that in theory, you don't need to have all of them on when there isn't full occupancy - but how do you tell a group 'you can't use the upstairs bedrooms' if they have paid the full rate?! And the tanks are probably larger than they need to be really. So the only thing we can try is to re-set each so that they are on for less time and see if there's still sufficient hot water when it is required.

[Ju]

Ju, is that 650€ for the electricity incl. standing charges and TVA? If so, that is really good.

Yes thats the whole lot. The property is not used in winter, and we have oil heating for the water. We no longer run the pool pump in the winter months as that was costing us, especially when you get into red days!

One of our other gites has an electric water heater, but it is only one heater for eight people, no one has ever commented on there being too little hot water, but I think it is the sort of system which heats most as required and just stores a little, the tank certainly isn't very big. For that property we don't get individual bills, its all mixed in with our house, but even so our bills are never anywhere near the size of Jane's. I don't fully understand why and architect would put in three different water heaters. Our gite has bathrooms in two different wings, with a large open plan kitchen/ living area and two very thick walls between, but one heater seems to work perfectly well.

[Fraise]

Crikey- 3 water heaters is a lot!! I have 2, for 2 reasons:
The original one isn't that big and when we converted another part of the house to be habitable it just wasn't big enough.
The second water heater only goes on when we are using 2 bedrooms in a different wing,plus the bar which also uses that water. I often don't have the 2nd one on at all and only ever during the cheaper electricity periods. I have the main heater set to come on during the cheaper periods too. We haven't run out yet !! 3 seems overkill!! We only have one in the gite and one of the comments from the guests of a couple of weeks ago (7 of them ) was that there is always oodles of hot water !!This heater also only comes on during the cheap electricity ( for that house I chose 2 am-7am and 1pm-4pm for the cheap rate ).

[la vache!]

Jane, have you considered the other electricity option, heures pleines/heures creuses? I have it in one of my houses and the water heater has it's own switch on the electric board, which means that the water heats up at night when it is the cheaper tarif. Could you do the same with your chauffe d'eau?
The electricity is cheaper and therefore not prohibitive for using electric radiators in winter, but the abonnement is slightly more expensive than the tarif bleu but it is recommended for people with water heaters.
http://particuliers.edf.fr/rubrique113.html

[Giddy Goat]

I don't fully understand why and architect would put in three different water heaters. Our gite has bathrooms in two different wings, with a large open plan kitchen/ living area and two very thick walls between, but one heater seems to work perfectly well.

Perhaps they figured this was the least invasive solution Ju - I'll ask them next time I see them! But what is Tempo? Different from heures pleines/heures creuses I take it - I don't know that option.

Susan, with regard heures pleines etc, this is what the said architects were signed up for for the time they lived in the house, which was around 18 months. EDF advised us to go for the tarif bleu because we wouldn't be there full time, but perhaps I should call them again and mention these water heaters as it sounds as if they are the energy gobblers.

[la vache!]

Jane,
tempo (which also has heures pleines et heures creuses option within it) is the 3 tarif system, whereby you have blue days (v. cheap) white days (medium) and red days (7 times the cost of normal electricity). You have guaranteed blue days 1st March - 31st October, so if you have a heated pool and most of your electricity usage is in the summer it can save you a fortune. However, in the winter, you sit there and freeze using no appliances at all on red days (and EDF always choose the coldest days), but for gites with low occupancy (or weekend/bank holiday occupancy which is what I get) it is ideal.
The other 2 tarifs are yours (bleu) and 'heures pleines heures creuses' which may help you reduce your bills.
You are right, it does sound time to get another survey done by EDF, your bill is far too high and I'm sure they will recognise this.

[Giddy Goat]

Thanks Susan again, and everyone. If there any further thoughts on this, post away folks, do please - the more info the better and may benefit others too of course.

[Fraise]

Jane, I've got Tempo in one house and the other is heures plein/creuse ( sorry, not bleu ).I think the Tempo should end up saving us money, I've only been on that for 18 months, before then heuresplein/creuse. It is quite a high standing charge but I figured I could save during the summer- I never have the pool pump on in winter,only summer. I do like the creuse/plein also though ( which is what I have in the gite ). I only changed to Tempo here cos I put up my thingies from 6 to 12 ( yes, really- just 6 !!) and thought I may as well go down the Tempo route. What are the thingies? Can't remember- amps,watts,some electricity input unit that I don't remember the name of Am I making any sense whatsoever?

[la vache!]

Fraise, it is KW - you need a minimum of 12 KW supply to qualify for the tempo tarif. But if Jane has electric radiators and the house is occupied in winter, it will be very expensive for her on red days (although there are only 21 if these to get through in the 5 months). I made a mistake earlier - the expensive time is from 1st November to 31st March, not 1st March.