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Guests whose unannounced friends join them
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Managing your guests
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kg1



Joined: 05 Jan 2010
Posts: 2347

PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

greenbarn wrote:
Anno wrote:
In my mind it's our home for the week or whatever so we can invite people round.


Ah, the ignorance and self-entitlement of some guests encapsulated in a single sentence - every rental owner’s nightmare.

No, it’s not “your home” to do with whatever you like. In the UK, you are not a tenant with the rights associated with that legal status, you have bought the right to occupy for a holiday let within the agreed terms, no more. That does not include sub-letting in any form, or exceeding any occupancy restrictions, or inviting people other than those made known to the owner to be at the property.


Exactly!!
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GillianF



Joined: 20 Aug 2012
Posts: 804
Location: Dordogne

PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 6:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Two things:

1. I too was concerned to see a comment to a post here from a guest rather than an owner. I always felt this was a place for us (owners) to discuss, share and comment shared experiences etc. I'm not happy knowing a past, existing or potential guest could read my comments. Why would someone who is not an owner be interested in this forum?

2. I agree with the comments that the guest commenting does not quite understand our side of the situation. We rent a property to sleep six people. If we give an under-occupancy discount it is on the understanding that they will only have linen and towels for the under-occupancy and are not entitled to have guests. Our Ts&Cs state the maximum capacity of the house is six and is not to be exceeded. We ask guests to let us know if they want to have guests for the day and this is at our discretion. If I thought it was being abused I would explain it was unacceptable. If a group of four book and then invite another couple that would be fine so long as I then had their names and could amend our booking form. This is all, as said above, for insurance, local tax, fire or other accident where we need to know EXACTLY who is is residence.

I wonder how the guest who says they should be free to invite who they wish to "their home" (which they have rented) would feel if they were having a dinner party or social gathering for invited guests if those invited guests then turned up with an entourage of others who expected to eat, drink etc. It is plain bad manners apart from any other issue.
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apexblue



Joined: 10 Sep 2008
Posts: 2199
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Same problem for us. House sleeps 6 and booking for 3 adults 3 children 2 cars. Counted 4 children and 3 vehicles, one a people carrier rolled up last night. Let's hope they breakfast on the terrace so I can do a head count.
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Frenchlady



Joined: 09 Dec 2013
Posts: 179
Location: Dordogne

PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In our early days in France we managed a 4 bedroom gite and lived in a cottage on site. After doing the normal Sat changeover and the guests arrived and settled in, a motorhome pulled into the drive . Cables from the van where pulled through windows and plugged into the house electricity (and I bet they were not proposing to use the showers in the motorhome either!!) We phoned the owners to check if they had agreed this could happen ... and you know the answer .... no, not a clue. A good job we were on site to see what was going on. I do not envy owners that do live on site, it must make their hair curl. When my OH does his pool visits to the gites he does a mental count of the numbers around the pool, of course not always accurate as some may be indoors or out but gives him a warning if he sees more than the number on the owners booking list.
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COYS



Joined: 06 Jun 2015
Posts: 794
Location: Greek Islands

PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spot on GillianF, but I'm afraid simple courtesy & good manners are being increasingly replaced by greenbarns eloquently referenced 'ignorance & self entitlement'
Being self managed this year has opened the shutters for us that's for sure in terms of how holiday property is (mis)treated these days. I'm not pretending it never used to happen - it did but it certainly wasn't commonplace. Now it has become perfectly acceptable to do & act as you please without any consideration of the possible consequences. As long as the selfies look good on Instagram that's all that matters right? No, but I do increasingly feel it is a semi-generational shift brought about at least in part by the sea change in the guest/traveller/visitor demographic so coveted by the OTA model, so we are also partly at fault for being coerced into accepting any booking, no matter how unsuitable via those channels. No turning back the clock now, that's for sure.
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teapot



Joined: 23 Oct 2013
Posts: 829
Location: Loire valley

PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to make you all feel better, I am so glad we are not renting this year Wink Very Happy
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loveka



Joined: 19 Aug 2016
Posts: 88

PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think, as this is a public forum, you need to be aware that anyone can post or read these forums.

Actually, I think it is important to know guest point of view. An understanding of why they behave as they do.

In only 3 weeks of rental I have had

A duvet along with Egyptian cotton duvet cover taken/ thrown away. Why? It has caused so many problems for me as I don't have a spare.

A huge stain on my brand new carpet that they must have seen. Why the hell didn't they tell us so we could have tried to remove it?

A pan burnt so badly it looked like it needed to be thrown away.

A child brought, despite it being clear that we should be told if children are coming.

Also, not guests, but my brand new sink chipped because my cleaner decided to remove the sink mat I had left in there. WHY!

I will be on site next year. Please tell me that it makes it easier?!
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COYS



Joined: 06 Jun 2015
Posts: 794
Location: Greek Islands

PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 11:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

loveka wrote:
I will be on site next year. Please tell me that it makes it easier?!


If our own experience is anything to go by loveka, then I'm afraid not.

I can trump a missing duvet cover with all 3 glass shelves from our fridge going AWOL???
Or from the same family group, a solid oak table leg snapped off after being dragged around to “make space to dance”.
I kid you not.

Roll on September 5th. Our last ever rental booking. It simply cannot come quick enough.
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e-richard



Joined: 17 Oct 2004
Posts: 4991
Location: Algarve, Portugal

PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Once again, I get quite upset at these threads that go on about US vs THEM.

Remember that THEY are OUR customers and its customers who make paydays possible.

Yes, its true that human beings behave differently when they find themselves in differing circumstances. Notable when they are on holiday or when they are working damn hard to repair a holiday home, but we all benefit from observing, talking, listening and interacting with one another.

I, for one, value any contribution on this website from guests and I also value the wisdom of owners explaining why they do things the way they do.
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PIMS: Holiday Rental Management system
They say we learn from our mistakes. That makes me a genius !
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Ecosse



Joined: 29 May 2014
Posts: 802
Location: Saint Gervais les Bains, France

PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

loveka wrote:


A duvet along with Egyptian cotton duvet cover taken/ thrown away. Why? It has caused so many problems for me as I don't have a spare.



That could have been embarrassment rather than anything else... it may have been a menopausal woman who stained the bedding and was too embarassed/private to own up and thought that as the bedding was ruined, it would be better to throw it out and hope no one (even other members of the group) find out. Annoying for you, still, but probably not done out of badness.
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gh



Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Posts: 739
Location: Poitou Charente/Moraira/UK

PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We have managers who look after our holiday home not ever been on site.

A couple of major events and many minor events over 13+yrs of renting.

The latest event was the theft off our brand new Dyson AM07 fan that we had taken over with us in the car.

On this occasion our cleaners were one down so we helped out and stayed on to do the meet and greet as we were heading to Spain and no rush. When the departed and the changeover clean was done it was missing.
When asked where it was, the guest denied it ever being in the house.
You couldn't make it up, thankfully we take a damage deposit so it covered the fans replacement, as they were not going to pay.

I agree we learn a lot from our guests, bad and good ones, constructive criticism is something I cherish.

I have no problem with non owners contributing to the forum, gives them the opportunity to see it from our POV also.
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apexblue



Joined: 10 Sep 2008
Posts: 2199
Location: UK

PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well 5 adults and 4 kids in our sleeps 6 confirmed.
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zebedee



Joined: 12 Sep 2014
Posts: 1039
Location: yorkshire dales

PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That’s awful Apexblue!
What age range are the children? (not that it matters as there are 4 of them!

Where do you think they are sleeping???
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apexblue



Joined: 10 Sep 2008
Posts: 2199
Location: UK

PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 6:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kids about 4. Extras on sofas? We don't manage this rental. They move out Sunday. Kids having a lovely time.
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Anno



Joined: 05 Oct 2007
Posts: 90

PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello again everyone.
Oh dear, I never intended to make people cross or offend anyone. For the record, if it needed clarifying, I am not at all in favour of guests cheating, lying, getting discounts on false bases (I understand that part of the problem but mustn't have made it clear), mistreating or stealing other people's property etc etc.
I take exception to the "ignorance and self-entitlement" and "nightmare" comments, as I was simply trying to put across what can be a "perception gap" between renters and owners. Sometimes what seems obvious to us is not at all obvious to others. Also, tone of voice can't be heard in a forum post and maybe the first part was a bit blunt! All the same when I said "in my mind" I did not mean "this is the absolute truth and anyone who thinks different is WRONG"... Personally I would never try to sneak extra overnight occupants in, etc, but I could very well have invited people round for the day without realising it would be considered a problem... I didn't say I should by divine right be able to invite people round without the owner having any say.
Some of you wonder what I'm doing here. Well I've followed these forums for years, after all they are nearly all public. I can't remember how I first came across them, but we always use holiday rentals for our holiday and I was just plain interested! And I have to say that from reading here I've come to realise a lot about owners' points of view and issues such as insurance, etc. So sometimes I thought it might be of interest to give the other side, or at least one version of it. I've always made it clear I'm not an owner and have never been told that I can't participate on that basis.
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